I always remove the dustcover when playing records. All my comments regarding the inner tube are with respect to it being off.

Good ideas from Jan, but I don't want to get sand anywhere near my turntable.

Additionally, as I mentioned before, the Rega always sounds better with it sitting the inner tube than not. I don't have any stability issues with the plinth when it is playing records, in fact, it seems quite stable.

Mosty, it just sounds better.

Here is a photo:

You guys should try this under amps, preamps and phono stages...it makes the system sound better when it is under them as well.

This sounds like a set of conflicting set of functionalities....perfect for application of Grigory Altshuller's TRIZ approach to inventive problem solving.

If we could measure the effect of resonances and "lossiness" in music output quantitively, than we could do Taguchi Robust DOE's to determine noise factors and make the turntable robust to them by adjusting control factors. In this case, resonance would be a noise factor (statistically speaking) and air bladder pressure and platform stiffness would be control factors.

True enough, but I can't bring myself to spend more than maybe $1500 on a turntable, like a Rega P5. Having been out of the high end for a long time, I am astonished at how high the high end has gotten!

Plus, some of the DIY aspects can be fun because they are so instructive!

Actually, my 1981 Rega Planar 3 has no suspension of it's own, at least not in the Thorens/Linn Sondek/Ariston/Systemdek sense. It's just a rigid plith that has the motor stuck to it with a strong tape, and a bearing for the platter. I do have a GrooveTracer subplatter for the Rega which is a big improvement, but basically, the isolation is provided by the feet and the composition of the plinth, plus the famous glass platter and felt mat.

The bottom of the Rega sits on the inner tube, which sits on a hard rock maple cutting board which sits on old 70's Audio-Technica isolator/leveler feet. Those feet sit on a Copenhagen record "credenza". Not the ideal table for the turntable, but I haven't gotten a proper rack for the Rega since yet I just started to listening to records again (for the first time in over 20 years) in the last six weeks or so.

And to be honest, I'm not going to get into all these sand-box filled tweaks, with straws, or DOEs varying air bladder pressure.

Instead, I'm going to spend my time instead listening to music.

Actually, my Rega has the new motor upgrade which no longer has the motor rubber band isolation system; it is directly coupled with an automotive industry adhesive pad that couples the motor to the plinth. There is no O-ring that provides suspension any longer.

The new Rega motor upgrade consists of a new motor (the same as the Rega P3-24) with dramatically less vibration and this adhesive pad, so that it can be directly coupled to the base. Also, the headshell on my SME is not detachable, so that should be less of an issue.

Regarding the bearing noise addition to the motor upgrade, I also am using a GrooveTracer subplatter that has three Delrin pads that the platter rests on, so provide additional decoupling of the subplatter to the main platter.

In addition to that, the subplatter spindle has a sapphire jewel bearing at it's business end instead of steel, and it now rests on a zirconium oxide ball bearing instead of a steel ball bearing. The runout of the subplatter is also about 5 X less than the stock platter, as measured by a dial indicator. The GrooveTracer subplatter has markedly reduced the noise floor of the Rega, so that now, with a nice record, it is dead quiet on a lead-in track even with my Arcam 280's volume turned to 80 dB. It's an impressive improvement, and beautifully constructed.

So, you can see, this is not a stock Rega any longer. But it sure sounds good.

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You've done some impressive upgrades for a basic table. But now you've stepped a bit out of the DIY area. What you've upgraded doesn't exactly eliminate the basic rules of how a table operates. Yes, you've improved on the stock, budget oriented components and I suspect the table sounds much improved over the original. Not to disparage your work but the essence of the Rega is its high quality at a budget price. You seem to have taken the table in the opposite direction and made a rather high priced table out of what was a budget product. All that's left of the original product is the plinth, a slab of MDF.

None the less, belts still react to the drag of a stylus and tonearms still resonate. The inner tube seems rather crude in comparison to what you've done to the table proper and still acts as a source for possible loss of information in such a "suspended" system.

With all you've done to the table proper, I wonder why you haven't pursued a more sophisticated suspension if that's how you wish to set up the Rega. And about how much are your table upgrades adding to the overall cost of the table? Why did you go this route rather than reaching the practical limits of the Rega and trading it for a higher quality table to begin with?

Well, I am not really concerned about the boundaries of DIY, either real or imagined. I'm just playing around. Because I am a scientist, and I just like to try things out. I'm just playing around with different things and seeing how they work out, doing experiments and gathering empirical data, so to speak. It amuses me to see what you can do with a budget table by thinking about the interactions. As for taking a budget component and going "higher-end" with it, well, back when I bought my Rega, it wasn't viewed as a budget component. And realistically, I don't really care if that's the direction I am taking. I tend to do those things, like I did way back when with my OLAs (Original Large Advents)...and am, in fact, doing now with another pair of Large Advents. In addition to being a scientist, I'm left-handed, which makes me a bit of a contrarian. I like the thought of improving every bit of the front end of a signal path to see how good you can get a pair of Advents to sound (pretty dang good, as it turns out...). Yeah, I've got another really nice pair of speakers, a pair of Era Design 4s that are awesome for what they are, which are currently a Class C Stereophile recommended component. But right now I am having more fun playing with tweakin' the Rega and the Advents and seeing what I can come up with...in some areas, the Advents flat smoke the Eras, like full-bodiedness and dimensionality, and high-level dynamic slam, not to mention bass. Wait until I disconnect them from the Arcam AVR280 and connect to my retro HK Citation 12! Right now, I am trying to determine what might be a suitable "vintage-design" preamp that would go well together with the Citation 12, Rega, and Advents. Maybe something tube-based, based on a "classic" design, like a beautiful little Cayin or JoLida preamp...but, I digress.

But mostly I am just doing this playing around because it amuses me.

As for the costs, I bought my Planar 3 back in '81 for $275. My SME III was around the same cost, maybe $295 or something like that. I haven't done anything to it for 27 years until a month ago when I bought the GrooveTracer subplatter for approx $250. I also bought a beautifully made acrylic platter for the Rega, but the glass platter/felt mat sound better. My Rega works great and sounds better; a testament to Roy Gandy's clear design thinking all those years ago. I will probably get a Rega P5 next year just so that I can have another cartridge to use for listening to records (my Grace F9E Ruby), but I have no plans to get a significantly more expensive turntable or get rid of my Rega.

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Right now, I am trying to determine what might be a suitable "vintage-design" preamp that would go well together with the Citation 12, Rega, and Advents. Maybe something tube-based, based on a "classic" design, like a beautiful little Cayin or JoLida preamp...but, I digress.

I ran my DLA's with a Citation 12 Deluxe (which I still own), at the time a Planar 3/Infinty Black Widow/ADC XLM III (sold it) and a Dayton Wright SPS mk.III (solid state) which I later sold for an Audible Illusions (tube). You might find a working APT pre amp or an Advent receiver (both solid state) or even a Superphon (ss) or a Counterpoint (tube).

Another Advent and Citation 12 user! A classic combination.

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Well, I am not really concerned about the boundaries of DIY, either real or imagined. I'm just playing around. Because I am a scientist, and I just like to try things out. I'm just playing around with different things and seeing how they work out, doing experiments and gathering empirical data, so to speak. It amuses me to see what you can do with a budget table by thinking about the interactions. ... In addition to being a scientist, I'm left-handed, which makes me a bit of a contrarian. I like the thought of improving every bit of the front end of a signal path to see how good you can get a pair of Advents to sound (pretty dang good, as it turns out...). ...

I too am a scientist/engineer, and may have been left-handed too before the school insist that we all write with the right hand. And I like experimenting too, as you seem to. By the way, I read somewhere that left-handers and ambidextrous people have a 10% larger corpus callosum (the interconnection between the two brain hemispheres) than right-handed people. What effect that has was not detailed in the article I read.

I've had a theory for a while that the percentage of left-handed people in the sciences is higher than in the general population. Wouldn't surprise me about the corpus callosum. I've also read that left-handed people have better ambidextrous skills than right-handed people.

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I've had a theory for a while that the percentage of left-handed people in the sciences is higher than in the general population. Wouldn't surprise me about the corpus callosum. I've also read that left-handed people have better ambidextrous skills than right-handed people.

Maybe so. I seem to remember hearing something like that too.

Any more info regarding the inner tube effectiveness?

On a similar note, I tinkered a lot with speaker building. One such example is the use of foam isolation between the enclosure that contains the high/mid frequency drivers and the bass driver. I could easily have used an inner tube instead of foam, but the foam gives me less "rocking" and good stability, with fairly good isolation. I didn't feel vibration transmitted from the bass enclosure to the high freq enclosure. Don't have an accelerometer, but a phono cartridge can sort-of act like one.

The inner tube works really, really well. I place it directly underneath the Rega and it always sounds better with the inner tube underneath than it does without it. I've removed it several times and listened to it without the inner tube with a variety of platforms, or just with the Audio-Technica feet, etc. and it always sounds better sitting on the inner tube, so I always go back to using it. I have one under my Arcam AVR280, and it made the system sound better when I put it under that at, as well. IMHO, anyone using a solid plinth-style TT like a Rega, Music Hall, Clearaudio, Pro-Ject, etc. that doesn't at least try this is not getting the performace from their table that they can be getting.

I particularly recommend that Stephen Mejias try it, given that he is a newly-born Rega/vinyl lover.