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CECE
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new issue

Let me be the first to post on the June issue which I have not yet received. But I'm sure it will entertain. I think the bias voltage this month may be 84V...? Do I have any takers? Where did they get a 72V battery anyway, it only looks like 1 cell. anyone take a measurement of teh actual voltages? Guess what, is it UL listed. anything above 30V is coming out of the realm of low voltages, like alarm systems, thermostats. But what do I know, I can't hear any improvements anyway. JA, we on for Thursday or Friday next week, send me a meassage. Wednesday i is in NYC, doing stuff let's do Thursday or Friday all day anytime I is available, but ya gotta let me know....

Monty
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Re: new issue

While you are waiting for this month's issue, you can pick up a copy of TAS. They have a review of several Van Alstine components.

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Re: new issue

I read it, I get that too. They did a poor review. They didn't mentioon WHICH magic wire all of a sudden made Frank's DAC be worth buying...what a load on nonsense. Both publications are loaded with full page ads for magic wires!! they just had to throw in a wire zinger to keep teh wire ads coming in and paying. I have teh AVA Ultra EC, not SL. I use AVA Hafler P500 rebuilt to OmegaStar EX and DH500 OmegaStar EX ckts. Great stuff, teh new Ultra preamp is QUIET, sounds incredible, teh phono section is Quiet, smoooth, lush, teh highs sparkle like LIVE music...it's a fantastic product, hybrid tube/mosfet. Only would like to have a rack mount face plate or add on ears, like Tascam and Audio control have add on ears, Tascam comes with the rack already, a lot of my stuff is rack mount, Furman, Rane,HHB,Tascam, I wanna get it all racked over time. All 4 Hafler/AVA amps are rack faces, rack is the way to go for ease of use, compacting a bunch of STUFF, access. Rack it baby. It's the SOUND BABY, AVA comes through with flying colors!!! Rack or no rack. no noise, no switching noises, nutin' but great sound

RGibran
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Re: new issue

Gentlemen, allow me to introduce the new Dickie V of audio!

RG

garysi
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Elite Audio Ad

Excuse my French, but WTF??!! The multi page ad running from page 53 to 63 for Elite Audio is nothing but an ad for the White Van Guys. Did anyone in the editorial dept, read the specs for this hooey??!!(Or is the sale of that much space enough to look the other way?) This is unacceptable for a magazine of this stature. I think the entire staff owes a big apology to us, your loyal readers(let's hope you don't lose any)

garysi
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Could I have been wrong? Maybe this is a joke, but, then again, April is long gone.

Editor
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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
Excuse my French, but WTF??!! The multi page ad running from page 53 to 63 for Elite Audio is nothing but an ad for the White Van Guys.

How do you know that, Gary. While I take what you say seriously, I don't see on the face of it that ad is what you say it is.


Quote:
Did anyone in the editorial dept, read the specs for this hooey??!!(Or is the sale of that much space enough to look the other way?)

The Chinese Wall between editorial and advertising works both way. The ad department doesn't see the editorial before we publish, but we don't see the ads until the book has been sent to the printers either.

I will ask our publisher, who is my equal on the magazine's business side, what the case is with this ad. But in the meantime, you might want to consider an attitude adjustment.

JohnA tkinson
Editor, Stereophile

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Folks -- Wow! You guys have really piqued my curiosity. I hope the Pony Express guy didn't get ambushed by some war party outside San Bernardino, and that my June issue arrives soon. I love all the ads, especially the ones that lie in pretty colors. Gary, you should have seen the one a few years back that showed Mark Levinson dry-humping a speaker, with buck-naked T&A right in front of his nose. The apple, I think, meant "temptation" and Mark was going for the woofer, just below the camera's lower range. Now, THAT was funny, and elicited several angry letters from folks who obviously had never been forced to make this difficult choice. Or the one with the babe playing (ahem) with the AC cord...it wasn't a Power Snake, was it? God, I hope not. Gary, you're not one of these prudes who live in the gray world of literal truth, who have to be fed listless facts all the time, are you? I sure hope not -- you're missing all the fun! JA, just keep the revenues coming in...the alternative wouldn't be pretty. Without Stereophile, I'd probably have to switch to one of those awful Motorcycle Magazines, and you know how THEY stretch the truth! Cheers, Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

This ad also caught my eye since I saw many of these speakers on ebay at anywhere between 150 - 600 dollars for a complete surround system. I was looking for a cheap surround system for my girlfriends son.

Hey, advertizing money is incomming funds that keep the price of the mag down and since JA hasn't reviewed them in the mag then I only take the ad as something to look into, if I was looking for speakers. So I can't say its a bad thing to put the ad in. I just thought it funny that the ad immediately made me think of the ones I listed below.
I'm not sure if they are exactly the same but they seem it.

Here are some links to similar items, some are different cabinet colors:

http://cgi.ebay.com/THEATER-RESEARCH-TR-...1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/THEATER-RESEARCH-TR-...4QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAND-NEW-SDAT-CES50...1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/SDAT-Digital-Floor-S...1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/CAT-SDAT-LEB-404-Hi-...1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/299-SDAT-Hi-Fi-Floor...1QQcmdZViewItem

hmmmmm
Don L

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

John and Clifton, I owe a big apology for my moment of unclarity. Gee, tis is one of those times where you wish you could blame it on the alcohol, but I have to take the blame. Clifton's right about the ad money, if it stops flowing, we could lose this mag, or have to shell out more for it. I have to take things with a bigger grain of sand, which I am usually good at, but there is always the momentary lapse of reason.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

You don't want to look at this then or your blood pressure will spike back up.

This might be decent enough gear, I have no idea, but a MSRP of $4799 in a respected audio magazine and an Ebay price of $875 for a new-in-box identical unit doesn't suggest these guys are serious about sound, IMHO.

Jim Tavegia
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

I just hope the check cashed OK from the folks who ran the ads. Pt Barnum is alive and well.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain, I am the great and powerful Oz!

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
John and Clifton, I owe a big apology for my moment of unclarity.

Thanks. We do take complaints about matters such as this seriously.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

mdjenders
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

I, for one, was shocked and dismayed upon sight of this fraudulent "Elite Audio" ad on pages 54-61 of the current Stereophile issue. I hoped this was just some sort of editorial snafu, but lo and behold, pages 98-99 feature a similarly bogus "Theater Research" ad. Gary, you were spot on with your criticism, and any "attitude adjustment" needs to be taken by Stereophile regarding its ad policies.

Money issues are one thing, but I don't feel that assisting in large-scale fraud is respectable practice for an audio magazine. I have been approached by these "white van" salesmen, and yes, they like to use these magazine advertisements as "proof" of the quality of their wares.

Stereophile should know that these adverts in such a widely known magazine could very well fool unsuspecting folk into being defrauded by bogus audio salesmen. As such, I would expect the magazine to publish a clear apology to its loyal readers in the next issue.

I immediately came to these forums, expecting to find some sort of apology from Stereophile about this travesty, but instead I find a quote from one of the most respected names in the high end audio industry, John Atkinson, in response to another shocked reader, stating:

"I don't see on the face of it that ad is what you say it is."

Please. Don't expect people to believe that even a novice in audio, let alone a professional high-end reviewer, cannot see at first glance that these pages promoting "5.1 DCS Digital", "5.1 Eds Digital", and a bunch of bogus awards are fakes. (Unless you really do think that Elite Audio laboratories are "one of the world's most revered names in high-end audio")

Rest assured, unless an apology is issued by Stereophile for this sad state of affairs, I will be cancelling my subscription promply. I know several of my audio enthusiast friends (and fellow subscribers) feel the same way.

From a disappointed subcriber,
Michael Jenders

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Jeez, I hope my issue arrives soon. Here I am, responding without even having seen the ad. Still, here goes. Michael, NOBODY is "unsuspecting" enough to blame an advertisement for a bad purchase. At the end of EVERY recommendation, by every reviewer, is the caveat, "listen for yourself." This isn't some two-bit dictatorship! This is the good ol' USA, where hyperbole rules! And this isn't even a review... it's an ad, for cryin' out loud. I'm sure JA will check it out. He will act appropriately. Now, let me ask you something, seriously. Have YOU HEARD the gear advertised in this outrageous farce? Do you KNOW, from your own LISTENING that the ad is making false claims? I like Cliff's comment. If you are offended by the ad, CALL THE ADVERTISING FIRM!!

Damn. Now I'm REALLY curious. But thanks for looking out for the aurally challenged of this world. I'm sure they appreciate it, wherever they are. Say...you aren't implying that I got a bad deal on my Triangles, are you? I found out about them from advertising (and ST's reviews). Say...you aren't suggesting that I'M aurally challenged, are you??? I have an idea. Why don't YOU apply for the job of Official Czar of Ad Censorship? Just a thought. Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
I immediately came to these forums, expecting to find some sort of apology from Stereophile about this travesty, but instead I find a quote from one of the most respected names in the high end audio industry, John Atkinson, in response to another shocked reader, stating: "I don't see on the face of it that ad is what you say it is."

That is correct. While my eyebrows were raised by these ads -- and as I also said, I don't see the ads in an issue until after it has shipped to the printer and I don't have any control over the advertising side of the magazine, nor should I -- I don't (yet) have any hard information that these ads are fraudulent.


Quote:
Rest assured, unless an apology is issued by Stereophile for this sad state of affairs, I will be cancelling my subscription promply.

I am sorry to hear that. As I also said, I immediately alerted Stereophile's publisher to the potential issues raised by the presence of these ads in our pages, and he is investigating which ad salesperson sold them, to whom were they sold, and what information do we have on the company that placed the ads. If it does indeed turn out that these ads are not what they purport to be, then we will not run them again.

I am not sure what else you would have us do, Mr. Jenders. I am also saddened that the value of Stereophile's entire editorial content to you is outweighed by the presence of these ads in a single issue, which may or may not be what you claim.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:

Rest assured, unless an apology is issued by Stereophile for this sad state of affairs, I will be cancelling my subscription promply. I know several of my audio enthusiast friends (and fellow subscribers) feel the same way.

Sadly, these guys in their 'white vans' hanging around Home Depot et al will use these ads in Stereophile to dupe many people into buying their junk. I can hear them now, "Stereophile wouldn't have it in their mag unless it was TOP of the line."

Got my mag yesterday in the mail been a LT subscriber. IMHO, sad day for the mag.

J.F. Megar Jr

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Okay, I'm really, really confused about what it is exactly that has got your panties all in a bunch. I just finished going through my copy of the June issue and quite frankly, the Elite ad, while somewhat of a joke, is no less of a joke than many other of the ads within the issue.

Here's some examples:

Page 17: The Wilson Audio ad which addresses the issue of value. $100K+ speakers and value used in the same sentence, what a joke.

Page 19: The Halco ad: "the best amplifier ever!" Such hyperbole. How could they!

Page 23: The Overture ad: The "Ultimate" musical experience - more hyerbole.

Page 24: Velodyne ad: Alex Smith endorses Velodyne. Who the hell is Alex Smith???

Page 31: Shunyata Research Inc.: "The Unanimous Choice" - I sure as heck didn't chose them.

Page 35: Krell: "New from Krell - Classic from Krell" Sorry guys, but something can't be both new and classic.

Page 37: Music Direct: "The World's Best iPod System" Again with that "Best" word.

Page 70: Burwen Bobcat: Claims to make MP3s sound like analog master tapes. This guy doesn't need the guys with the white van, he needs the guys with white coats.

Page 72: Siltech: DUP's favorite - this month's cooking class.

And I'm quite sure that there are a few more worth noting but I would hope that you have gotten my point. Which has Clay said "This is the good ol' USA, where hyperbole rules!" So caveat emptor.

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Frank --

Only dupes can be duped. I'll wager that anyone expecting to find state-of-the-art sound equipment at Home Depot may be beyond saving (I have heard, though, that they carry a decent AC cord). If the Stereophile staff checked out the equipment behind every ad, I guess they would be reviews, not ads, eh? I'm still waiting to hear from you (or anyone else who has actually auditioned this equipment) as to how the stuff actually sounds. A discounted price at E-Bay is hardly grounds for fraud...unless, of course, the system is hot. Cheer up -- dupes get duped and become wiser for the experience. All education has some sort of tuition. Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
All education has some sort of tuition.

And a worthwhile education is always expensive.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:

Hi, Frank --

Hello!

I see you're in LA, I'm in San Diego.

Remember the up-roar when the ad dept took an auto ad? At least that auto wasn't a Yugo... get my drift?

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Alex Smith is a second year quarterback with the San Francisco 49ers.

That's a heck of an endorsement deal his agent must have chased down!

Maybe quarterbacks have keener insight with regard to low frequency sound reinforcement?

He went to college in Utah. You'd think he'd be endorsing Wilson.

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Yeah, there's no explaining individual tastes -- Alex could certainly afford the drive to Provo, and I think Wilson has a budget sub for only about 30 large. Maybe too many head-slaps from sonically-challenged Defensive Ends, eh? When I was at Utah, our all-american was Lee Grosscup, who was a #1 pick for the Giants. He ended up in the ABC booth. C'mon, Buddha, give Alex a chance -- he was so good in college! Ooops! I forgot. There was Scott whatizname, the lefty QB from Utah in the late '80's, who was the Lions' #1 pick. Well, maybe next year. Still, I gotta stay loyal to my undergrad Alma Mater. Cheers, Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Frank -- hey, if you're in San Diego and you have the June issue already, where's mine? Maybe it's being delivered by Yugo. I actually saw one a couple weeks ago, sputtering down Glendale Blvd. Jeez, at least the price was right! I can't wait to see the ad. I bet nobody at Elite expected THIS kind of publicity. I still think you should review it. Cheers, Clifton

Jeff Wong
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

My issue arrived yesterday. The MSRPs listed in those ads seem quite ridiculous, especially in light of Monty's post:


Quote:
You don't want to look at this then or your blood pressure will spike back up.

This might be decent enough gear, I have no idea, but a MSRP of $4799 in a respected audio magazine and an Ebay price of $875 for a new-in-box identical unit doesn't suggest these guys are serious about sound, IMHO.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
Alex Smith is a second year quarterback with the San Francisco 49ers.

That's a heck of an endorsement deal his agent must have chased down!

Maybe quarterbacks have keener insight with regard to low frequency sound reinforcement?

He went to college in Utah. You'd think he'd be endorsing Wilson.

Buddha,

You never fail to amaze me or at least crack me up. Based on the fact the Velodyne ad mentions the fact that Alex Smith is a) #1 draft pick b) a San Francisco 49er and C) a quarterback, I already had a pretty good idea about who he is. What I meant was who is he that I should care about his endorsement of a subwoofer? DUH!!

Now if it was JLo, that would be a different story. She has made a serious amount of money from the "bottom end", so her opinion I would respect, but Alex Smith. Sorry, he just doesn't cut it.

Here's a quick list of possible celebrity endorsements:

JLo - bottom end - subwoofers
Dolly Parton - top end - tweeters
Jane Fonda - negative feedback
Michael Moore - biased interconnects
Karl Rove - imaging

Jeff Wong
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Maybe if Smith was endorsing a tuner, you could at least say he had experience with receivers. I'm sure there's something there for interconnects with "Shotgun", too.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Jazzfan!

I haven't seen the issue yet. In Vegas, we get ours via Pony Express or Colorado River barge, or something.

I actually figured that "Alex Smith" must be some Hi-Fi guru, self appointed or otherwise, so I was actually kidding about Alex Smith the QB.

Now, I'm amazed. Why the Hell would his endorsement mean anything?

For subwoofer endorsements, I'd expect Sam Ramey or that guy from The Oak Ridge Boys who sings, "Yeeeeaaaaah" after they sing "Elvira, Elira, my heart is on fie-ruh, for Elvira."

Maybe that one Blind Boy of Alabama, too.

Really, that was the same Alex Smith, eh?

Well, let's help him out:

"Hi, I'm Alex Smith, future Hall of Fame quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers. After playing 20 pre-season and regular season games...well, I didn't really play in all of them, but I'm on the team, for now...I've stood under center enough to know that a good bottom end is crucial in football as well as in Hi-Fi. I also know that Velodyne gives me better bottom than Beyonce Knowles wearing a Dirty Sanchez.

Only Velodyne can ellicit the real-world bottom end sensation of having a rusty trombone right there in my listening room.

Owning Velodyne has helped me score more often than telling people I'm a pro football star!

Wilt Chamberlain?

Amateur!

If you really want alotta bottom in your house 24-7, go Velodyne. I know I do!"

________________________________

Hope that helps.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

I understand that not everyone will be as troubled as I am about these ads, but it is refreshing to see that others were similarly saddened to find these ads in Stereophile.

This is not an issue of unjust ad censorship. Regardless of what you may think of the ads normally found in Stereophile, these are well respected audio companies pitching quality products capable of some degree of high end performance.

A little Googling will inform anyone about white van speakers (and the "brands" in question) and confirm to anyone what these ads represent, and I am pleased to hear from JA that this topic is being investigated.

Jeff Wong
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

I have to admit I didn't expect high-end gear, football, Dirty Sanchez and rusty trombone to be mentioned in the same breath.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

BaBa Booey, TaTa toothey, ma ma monkey? Reiley Martin?

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
I have to admit I didn't expect high-end gear, football, Dirty Sanchez and rusty trombone to be mentioned in the same breath.

Jeff,

Speaking of rusty trombones, with Elite Audio equipment you can actually tell the brand of oil being used on a slide trombone on a well recorded CD. How many so called "high end" brands can make, or would be willing to make that claim?

Not only that, the van is not white, it's eggshell.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:

Quote:

Rest assured, unless an apology is issued by Stereophile for this sad state of affairs, I will be cancelling my subscription promply. I know several of my audio enthusiast friends (and fellow subscribers) feel the same way.

Sadly, these guys in their 'white vans' hanging around Home Depot et al will use these ads in Stereophile to dupe many people into buying their junk. I can hear them now, "Stereophile wouldn't have it in their mag unless it was TOP of the line."

Got my mag yesterday in the mail been a LT subscriber. IMHO, sad day for the mag.

J.F. Megar Jr

I've been a subscriber for the past 3 years. I too was a little taken aback when I saw the Theater research and Elite Audio ads in the latest issue. I've seen similar ads on Ebay and have always chuckled inwardly, immediately thinking about white vans. I feel however that this ad could do some real damage. As mentioned by someone previously, these products and their price can be legitimized to potential customers since they have appeared in Stereophile. All they will have to do is get multiple copies of this issue and use it for the next 10 or so years without running a single other ad. To me this looks much like a white man scam, whatever anyone says. If I am proven wrong and hasty in making conclusions- GREAT! At least I can rest easy knowing people will not be duped. It definitely is up to the folks at Stereophile to check up on this and let us know of the outcome. Especially since most of us trust the Stereophile review and editorial staff and hold them in high esteem.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Ajay,

Okay. I finally got my June issue, although I had to pull a few arrows out of the Pony Express guy's back and water his nag. I finally read the offending ad. Ajay, Frank, and mdjender, I STILL don't see the fuss. The ad speaks for itself. It is so obviously all rot that NO Stereophile reader would do anything but laugh at it. I loved the disembodied, "Z3 is by far the sweetest sounding receiver I have ever heard," the "I" remaining forever unknown. Blue power watt meter. Bullet aluminized cones. 400 watts program per channel. Pure II decoding. Digital imaging. Absolute power! (I have to admit, that one had me reaching for my credit card -- I MUST - HAVE - ABSOLUTE - POWER. Exlamation point). FM/AM present tuner (to think mine has been absent all these years). Tube amlifier pushing 3000 watts (picture-in-circle of something that looks like a Martian IUD). Digital elite audio. Guys, this stuff makes fun of itself. Look, these honyocks wanted to reach the Stereophile audience. They paid big bucks to do it. Now their target audience is rolling on the floor. If I were at the ad desk at Stereophile (Primedia?), I would get these yokels on the horn FAST and lock 'em in for a 20-page spread for next month. I'd butter 'em up a bit on the success of THIS ad, and nail 'em for the "Super Deluxe Spread, available to only our finest customers!" I believe it was Jesse Livermore who said, "it is absolutely immoral to let a sucker keep his money." If YOU refuse it, he'll just go 'round the corner and give it to somebody else. I'd bleed these suckahs 'til ALL their advertising budget was safely in my hands, and I'd cash the checks before the ink was dry. As JA noted, a good education costs a premium, and here's Stereophile's opportunity to become Teacher of the Year. Hell, maybe JA can pocket some of the commissions and buy us all a beer next week! Cheers, Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

By the way, you weren't offended by the Velodyne ad? Alex Smith is six-feet-five and this thing comes up to his chest! People in Los Angeles are paying 2 million bucks for condos that are smaller than this. And, yet, Velodyne can buy up copies and show 'em to potential customers for ten years...and they'll be hooted at for ten years. Ads are, um, ads. Period. They all lie. Hyperbole is the operant trope. Anybody who makes a buying decision from reading an ad is a moron who, as I said, needs education FAST. Holy cow, Cub fans, lighten up! The money goes to a good cause. Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi Clifton,

I guess I see it a little different from you. I feel that, in this instance, the target audience is NOT your average Stereophile reader. Most of us would recognize the hyperbole and lack of facts in the ads in question. Given the exorbitant MSRPs listed and the actual prices that these items command on Ebay, it appears to me that this ad is presumably to entice people into buying a 'bargain' that has a list price 5X the asking price. This is really hard to pass up. The fact that their print ads run in highly reputable magazines just makes the deal that much better. Where are these products sold excepting on Ebay and possible on an individual basis? If they offered a money back guarantee as other REPUTABLE mail order businesses do (Axiom, ACI, Onix, Aperion, Ascend etc.) then I would have zero problem with the ad. The point I am trying to make is that I feel that what will happen is that individuals will try to sell these products to people who believe they are getting a fantastic bargain. If and when the buyer realizes he has been duped, it will be too late. OTOH, if this a legitimate ad by a company with the means to allow a return policy (or for individals to actually hear and see the item at a showroom), then I take back every thing I've said. I'm just concerned with people being potentially conned into buying what may turn out to be junk. Regarding the Velodyne ad, let us not forget that Velodyne has a reputation for making superb subwoofers. It is NOT an unknown company like Elite Audio (though the Elite ad does claim they are 'one of the world's most revered names in high-end audio'). I also wonder about the name. It may be positioned to be mistaken for Elite by Pioneer. It all seems really fishy to me.
Yes, Alex Smith probably has no idea what great bass is, but the fact remains that you never have to buy Velodyne sight unseen (sound unheard??). they obviously have a wordwide dealer network. However, I agree that the choice of AS as a spokeman is a little bizarre.

Ajay

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

ok so let's say "someone" got duped, and now someone has a ea-505 5.1 2000watt hunk of junk.. is it worth plugging into my grandma's tv or something? and realistically what is this thing worth? Should I just toss it in the trash and forget it happened? btw, i paid 200 if anyone was curious exactly how dumb I happen to be.

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Jdeclue1 -- I think you should enjoy the music you play through the system as much as you can. If you don't sense any dissatisfaction, you have an enjoyable home system for 200 bucks. If you do, eventually, tire of this system, 200 bucks is a small price to pay for admission to the upgrade club. Give them to some young headbanger, or sell 'em for the price of a couple of CD's. Then use the knowledge acquired to be more careful when you move up in quality. Pinpoint what, eventually, turned you off and avoid repeating the mistakes. Enjoy the music, and go nuts like the rest of us. Cheers, Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Ajay -- it seems there are two issues here, for people who object to the ad. One of them is protective: nobody wants to see an unwitting consumer get screwed by a pseudo-legitimate come-on. All I can say to this one is, we all learn by our mistakes. Ad hyperbole is a convention. Anyone who makes a buying decision based solely on ad hype deserves what he gets. Period. This is home stereo, not a wonder drug with side effects. The second issue is indignance. Many who say Stereophile should not accept such ads voice the fear that, somehow, Elite may profit from running the ad. This is a different issue. Business people budget for advertising in order to INCREASE overall profits. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. If it works, it is money well spent by Elite. If it doesn't, they should (and will) advertise elsewhere. Stereophile's job is to print the ads and cash the checks. The customer's job is simply to know where he is. In the USA. Where hyperbole is the dominant trope in advertising. Where people lie on TV, in magazines, and on your computer to make a buck. If you are in the market for ANY product and don't know these obvious facts, you need to pay up for your education. Caveat Emptor. Period. Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Normally, I would agree that running ads is just part of media business. However, there is a point when discretion must be used in determining what ads are appropriate for a particular publication. If Stereophile values the brand they have created over the last 40 some odd years they will exercise their discretion in denying these sorts of ads.

As it stands, this can be chalked up to a mistake that can be corrected for the future. Continuing to run these ads suggests something completely foreign to the pursuit and advocacy of superior audio reproduction.

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Hi, Monty --

I guess there is a third issue here -- pride of ownership, for want of a better phrase. Many subscribers ("owners" by subscription) who object to the ads seem to feel betrayed by the presence of interlopers, or feel they are somehow being stained by the (to them) parasitical presence of an illegitmate relative they didn't invite to the reunion. I guess this is just a personal thing that doesn't really bother me, even though it bothers others on a similarly personal level. For me, this is not worth arguing over, since the point is moot, and my "stake" in the magazine has no relationship to its advertisers. I take them all with a grain of salt, "legitimate" or otherwise. I have to say, though, that for me Stereophile's 40 years of building a positive brand name is based on the quality of their writing -- that is, their writers' abilities to combine wit and detachment in their reviews, without dogma or pompous strutting, and their unique combination of subjective judgment tempered by objective measurement and data analyses. And, of course, the sense of genuine technical expertise they communicate. Point taken, Monty, since I respect your contributions to the forum so much...but I can't imagine being genuinely offended by any ad in any context, because I just don't take them seriously. I just laugh at the bad ones and check out the good ones, as dictated by my own personal filtering mechanisms. Cheers, Clifton

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Re: Elite Audio Ad


Quote:
I immediately alerted Stereophile's publisher to the potential issues raised by the presence of these ads in our pages, and he is investigating which ad salesperson sold them, to whom were they sold, and what information do we have on the company that placed the ads. If it does indeed turn out that these ads are not what they purport to be, then we will not run them again.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

I just got my June issue - I was one of the overseas victims of June's problems - and was shocked when I saw the "Elite audio" ads. I've never seen such a transparent scam in my life, and it's sad indeed that Stereophile got mugged by these jokers.

Or was it a case of "see no evil"? The jokers bought a huge quantity of ad space, Stereophile can pretend shock and dismay and never run such ads again . . . which is no sweat, since the jokers never wanted to run them more than once . . .

Either way, you should have inserted an apology to your readers - and the unwashed suckers out there that may get hoodwinked - in July's "As We See It".

Carl Hoefer
Castelldefels, Spain

never2subscribe
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

...Concerning the Elite Audio ad...First of all great statment Gary and if there is any question as to whether the magazine made a bad decision take a look at my screenname...says it all!!!

Sure I'm at fault for buying the stuff but I will have to say that having the ad was a big push in their favor. I'm not too pissed yet (will be if this system doesn't even turn on). Gave me the "need to move it now before we get to the site to install the other system" (2 in the truck - not a van but a VERY nice truck). Everyone sported "Dream Audio Works" gear. Well I told them I'd give them $200 now and another $200 tonight if it's decent. After some bs they agreed. Basically I doubt they'll be around for the $200 nor will they return the first $200. So my question is...what is this stuff worth? $200? A bit premature I know since I haven't heard it yet but I'm sitting here at work and curious....

Thanks guys and for sterophile...the "van guys" said they'd cover the subscription cost so expect payment any day.....

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Wow, 200 bucks, and what was the supposed "list price" on the gear you bought?

reckedracing
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

well, sure as shit...
someone approached my friend today with your magazine with the 10 page ad spread...
unfortunately he thought he was getting a good deal based on the "brand name recognition" of the magazine...

so who gets the cookie for predicting the future with this one?


Quote:
Stereophile should know that these adverts in such a widely known magazine could very well fool unsuspecting folk into being defrauded by bogus audio salesmen. As such, I would expect the magazine to publish a clear apology to its loyal readers in the next issue.

Buddha
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

This is getting more amazing every day.

So, these budding audiophiles who you guys all happen to know get approached by someone offering gear at something like 2% of list price, and they're amazed that what they bought is not the good shit?

Well, that answers one question.

Now, the only other question we need to answer is exactly what KIND of idiots these people are.

Reckedracing, why didn't your retarded friend's guardian call you before he threw money at that stuff? Even if by osmosis, your friend should have been keen enough to smell that audio rat.

_____________________________
_____________________________

At the confluence of greed and stupidity wait the whirpools.

reckedracing
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

i wasn't saying my friend didn't making a mistake, just confirming what others already posted regarding people using this advert to scam others...

Buddha
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Apologies for my cynicism last night, Reckedracing.

This whole scam kind of fits the "If it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't" category. Like people thinking they bought a real Rolex for 40 bucks form some guy in a trench coat!

On the plus side, I bet those white van people bought several thousand copies of that issue, eh?

Once again, apologies for being so dour last evening.

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

People scam themselves. The particular advertisement that triggers the gullibility gene only greases the slope. What if he likes the way they sound?

gkc
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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Buddha, if you would stop sobering up, you wouldn't have to spend so much time apologizing for the things you say and do. How many times have I told you to keep the nipple IN your mouth and never to drink anything clear? Reckedracing, Buddha really IS a good, well-meaning soul...he just occasionally forgets his medication.

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Re: Elite Audio Ad

Well 4 $200 bucks I got what I figured i would...a $200 system. These losers actually called me to see if I liked it and willing to pay the other $200. I just laughed and said nah sounds horrible where would you like to meet so i can return it. After some babbling about his buddy having the $$$ i just said forget it, call me if you want it back. Roommates love it...no worries on the bass rattling their room!

No hard feelings with the van guys, I got an "average" system with 5 speakers, sub, reciever, remote, etc. for $200. i will have to say it was extremly irresponisble of the magazine to print the add. It was the first thing shown to me. Maybe the mag needs to require samples sent in from new companies before their allowed to advertise...hey more free $hit why not?!

Well I'm off to rock my new system... ...you kids have fun with this electronic crap. Later!!!!!

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