You are here

Log in or register to post comments
Buddha
Buddha's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 11 months ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 10:24am
JA, a golden opportunity missed. Missed! The Esoteric MG-20.

Just got done with some travel and had a chance to catch up. The Esoteric review killed me!

"Although my review samples had been used at audio shows, Esoteric's Mark Garvey warned me that they'd need further break in....yada yada yada."

First, Esoteric is in the habit of demoing speakers that they are aware are not yet sounding their best?

I wonder how they could solve that problem? Jeez. Did that make anyone else wonder? Does Esoteric, like, not really give a shit? "Aw, it's just for a show. Screw it."

But wait! Apparently they do know the answer to solve the conundrum of speaker break-in: "...Accordingly, he sent me the Isotek Full System Enhancer & Rejuvination Disc, which he feels cuts the total break-in time by almost two thirds..."

If only Mark Garvey had solved that riddle before the speakers were used for show demos!

But, wait...

More importantly..."The sound was a little on the lightweight side at first, but after several treatments with the Isotek CD, the lower frequencies were more usefully fleshed out..."

Man, if only someone with some measuring equipment had been around for that transformation!

Imagine, an un-broken-in high end speaker, straight from the manufacturer's use of that un-broken-in speaker that was nevertheless used to demonstrate to the world how good that speaker sounded, with the manufacturer apparently knowing how to break it in and thereby make it sound better (for the show,) but never bothered to, who later tells a reviewer that the same speaker needed more break in in order to sound better, and having an actual repeatably dependable break-in source (the break in CD) that he sends to said reviewer, who then comments about the sonic effectiveness of the break in process...all without one sweep of a meter to look and see what may actually be happening!

Tragic.

That would have been killer to see the before and after curves!

You Maniacs! You didn't measure break in! Ah, damn you! Damn you all to hell!

jazzfan
jazzfan's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 8:55am
Buddha Does DUP

Buddha,

You're beginning to sound a lot like DUP, although somewhat funnier.

Please rename this thread to "Buddha Does DUP".

linden518
linden518's picture
Offline
Last seen: Never ago
Joined: Dec 12 2007 - 5:34am
Re: Buddha Does DUP

I'm just praying that you aren't saying "Buddha does DUP" in the same idiomatic sense as "Debbie does Dallas."

jazzfan
jazzfan's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 8:55am
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:
I'm just praying that you aren't saying "Buddha does DUP" in the same idiomatic sense as "Debbie does Dallas."

Be afraid, be very afraid.

dbowker
dbowker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 1 week ago
Joined: May 8 2007 - 6:37am
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:

Quote:
I'm just praying that you aren't saying "Buddha does DUP" in the same idiomatic sense as "Debbie does Dallas."

Be afraid, be very afraid.

Or perhaps... "DUP Throat?"

Buddha
Buddha's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 11 months ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 10:24am
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:
Buddha,

You're beginning to sound a lot like DUP, although somewhat funnier.

Please rename this thread to "Buddha Does DUP".

You cut me to the quick.

Believe it or not, my sentiment kind of came from the world of wine.

There has been a tempest blowing in the hobby about a famous wine critic and famous auction house director who had perpetually plotzed over wines of questionable provenance.

Once the facade on this charade came tumbling down, the critic fell back on, "Well, regardless, the 1921 (probably fake) was still the finest wine I've ever tasted."

End of discussion. Absoluetly no curiousity as to how this bit of fakery may have been achieved or any examination of what really took place.

I started to wonder if I did that in my realms of interest (I know I have done it in my love life... ...), or if one of my other hobbies had lapses, and the Esoteric review struck me as a real disconnect between Esoteric's apparently lackadaisical approach to how their flagship product is being presented, their spoken insight in this regard, and JA's acceptance of their lack of effort, and then what seemed like a golden opportunity to check out a very very interesting phenomenon.

I, for one, would be fantastically interested in measurements of the "break-in" phenomenon. I am a believer in it, as Espoteric seems to be. They just don't seem to care very much about it.

Also, I trust JA enough to bring it up and see what Esoteric's approach semed like to him! I also read the review three times, so I'm obviously a Stereophile nerd, eh?

linden518
linden518's picture
Offline
Last seen: Never ago
Joined: Dec 12 2007 - 5:34am
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:
I, for one, would be fantastically interested in measurements of the "break-in" phenomenon.


I actually did get a sense of this from your original post, and despite the "rant-ish" humor, got the earnest sense of your inquiry. So your post wasn't really DUP-ish, at least for me. But the title "Buddha does DUP" does really trip me up.

DUP-throat?! You're a filthy man, Doug. Just filthy!

RGibran
RGibran's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 1 week ago
Joined: Oct 11 2005 - 5:50pm
Re: JA, a golden opportunity missed. Missed! The Esoteric MG-20.

It seems to me they got the title of the review incorrect. It should have been the "Isotek Full System Enhancer & Rejuvination Disc".

Look it up. It's a demag tool as well. And, believe it or not, suggests it be used on a continual basis as an exercise tool to keep your system in tip top shape. Otherwise your system slips back to sounding, ahem, less fleshed out!

Dang JA....you could have rubbed some cream on the upstream components and taped some tin foil to the speakers.

Another review of a speaker we have no idea of how it really sounds?

RG

KBK
KBK's picture
Offline
Last seen: Never ago
Joined: Sep 30 2007 - 12:30pm
Re: JA, a golden opportunity missed. Missed! The Esoteric MG-20.

I, for one, would be fantastically interested in measurements of the "break-in" phenomenon.

There's nothing to it really.

Before, everything is great.

After.....all your shit is gone or trashed.

rvance
rvance's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 month ago
Joined: Sep 8 2007 - 9:58am
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:

Quote:
I, for one, would be fantastically interested in measurements of the "break-in" phenomenon.


I actually did get a sense of this from your original post, and despite the "rant-ish" humor, got the earnest sense of your inquiry. So your post wasn't really DUP-ish, at least for me. But the title "Buddha does DUP" does really trip me up.

DUP-throat?! You're a filthy man, Doug. Just filthy!

Ironically, in Jamaican lore, Duppies are malevolent spirits who hang around after death making life for the living miserable. Sound familiar??

Buddha is The Duppy Conqueror!

mrlowry
mrlowry's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 1 month ago
Joined: May 30 2006 - 1:37pm
Re: Buddha Does DUP


Quote:
I'm just praying that you aren't saying "Buddha does DUP" in the same idiomatic sense as "Debbie does Dallas."

Now THAT might get rid of DUP once and for all, but I wouldn't ask Buddha to go through that. But it would bring a new meaning to taking one for the team.

jazzfan
jazzfan's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 8:55am
Re: Buddha Does DUP

Hi Buddha,

I'm sorry to have stepped on your toes, it's just that after reading your original post I couldn't tell if you were joking or serious. Now that I know that you are serious, let me pose a few questions.

1) How would one (i.e. JA) go about measuring "break-in"?

2) Would there be anything to measure? I'm guessing that the equipment used to test this elusive phenomena just would not be able to register any differences or changes in the sound of the equipment being tested.

So what do you propose?

Buddha
Buddha's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 11 months ago
Joined: Sep 8 2005 - 10:24am
Same old same old.

Hi, Jazzfan.

I'm liking your radio play list!

I'd be interested in seeing just what JA could find with tools he already has.

Impedance graphs should reveal changes in the drivers as they break in. If surround compliance changes with break in, I would think (but could be wrong,) that the impedance curve would reveal this.

Does frequency response change?

Imagine keeping the speaker and mic in exactly the same place and then plotting frequency response data to see if that changes!

We don't know, but would dispersion characteristics change?

I'd be completely happy with the same old same old measuremnets, and just seeing if we could see a difference.

It's not that I demand 'proof' of break in, I'd just like to see if something does show up.

I'm also not demanding this be done for every speaker, I'm just thinking that if we keep discussing it, this would have been one time where a perfect opportunity presented itself.

If it shows up, cool, if not, oh well.

JA's review made it seem like such a dramatic event was occurring, with a specific product performing feats of sonic wonder, that maybe we could have gotten a glimpse into this phenomenon.

  • X
    Enter your Stereophile.com username.
    Enter the password that accompanies your username.
    Loading