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tandy
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Discussion of AVA gear

Hey DUP,

Since you push product so much; wasn't there a review just beneath the "ten myths of audio" that "fried" AVA's player??

digital-audio
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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Please provide a link to that post "ten myths of audio" would you. I might be interested in reading that.

Sorry for your problems with Wadia! In any case, any component no matter how expensive it is is going to eventually break down. NASA has catastrophic failures too. I am not excusing the Wadia organization for not getting back to you and I do not know their turn around on the parts availability, stock for parts, etc. Maybe this will be an opportunity to make their service department faster to respond to the initial inquiry.

Lamont Sanford, you could be right. Wadia is a great engineering company but I did read somewhere that they have been in and out of business at least one other time. That said I think their product line is great and they are showing on their website some new audio equipment...but at this time I do not own any of their gear and this might put a damper on my considering to buy some as well.

Thanks

CECE
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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

AVA doesn't make a "player". You might be thinking of something else?

tandy
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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

http://www.theaudiocritic.com/back_issues/The_Audio_Critic_26_r.pdf

Page 27, the omega 4 dac I stand corrected.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Hey 301!

Carl should be bashing AVA gear according to the review. It is some of the worst gear the reviewer ever saw in his life and does not recommend anyone purchase it.

I read the 10 lies you directed me to and kept reading. In that same issue page 27, the reviewer debunked the quality control of Van Alstine gear as he reviewed Van Alstine Omega IV DAC.

NO 96kHz sampling, No toslink input, No digital outputs and states, "Cheap twisted-pair cables connect the digital-in jack to the PC board." Then goes on to continue to bash it!

http://www.theaudiocritic.com/back_issues/The_Audio_Critic_26_r.pdf

Read the above link regarding Van Alstine gear. Quite a shocking review. The reviewer cannot believe how poorly it is made and how badly it measured. I wonder if this is the way ALL Van Alstine gear is made? This is the most important piece of gear, the DAC!

Full-scale THD of -66db across the entire spectrum and that is it...its worse than a cheap hand held AM radio made in the 1960's. Maybe it was made in Cuba!

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

That unit is out of production aa long time. They are now OmegaStar ckts and Ultra DAC, i have the Ultra DAC hybrid like ultra EC pre ampand Ultra phase inverter hybrid, Omega IV is way back OmegaStar DAC got a "golden ear" award, whatever that is from one of teh other magazines Why don't Stereophile review teh AVA line of Ultra stuff DAC, phase inverter, preamp some Fet valve 550 a..let's see what they think about it...time to stop shunning AVA, great stuff priced for mortals. AND ya don't need magic wires to use a a tone control, since the pre amp can drive anything without changes in sound, plenty of drive current into what ever loads it sees Reliable, they just do it right, what a concept.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Oh, now i know what that was, AVA mentioned why they got such a crappy review, he suspects it was not factory sent, it may have been modded by unauthorized persons...If ya wanna know exactly, send Frank an e-mail He will tell you about that debacle.. The results of that test are way off base....

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Based on that review alone I would NEVER buy and components from Audio By Van Alstine.

The fact that it is no longer being made makes NO difference. They made it. End of story.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

"Oh, now i know what that was, AVA mentioned why they got such a crappy review, he suspects it was not factory sent, it may have been modded by unauthorized persons..."

He doesn't know if he sent it? "it may have been modded by unauthorized persons"? Doesn't he know his own designs, if he used different size caps in the +/- rails for example?

No mention of holes where the toslink input, digital outputs were removed? What about the holes for the missing regulators that were removed, or were the regulators doing multiple duty by design?

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Ask Frank, I bet he will explain the mess. So reviewers only get product to review from teh mfg? Never from some outside source? Hmmm, i think i just seen a review on a $6500 phono cartridge that a person sent in, not a mfg source. And I belevie teh DAC reviewed was modified not by AVA, thus the piss poor workmanship etc. You obviously have never seeen inside an AVA unit. See, you dismiss a product without first hadn experience, how dare you, if other's do it, everyone gets upity. Never seen a poor solder joint on an AVA in all my units, ever. Ya don't need a optical connector if ya ain't using it do ya? Majority of use is digital coax, you want to pay for it, and not need it, explain that logic,

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Carl,

The entire UNIT sucked. Not just one part was incorrect! The entire Audio by Van Alstine unit as reviewed SUCKED.

AVA gear sucks.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Isn't it amazing that the reviewers reviews are so solid...and in this ONE case by some fluke chance the ONLY component to get switched or finagled with before a review is the Audio by Van Alstine component? Go figure.

The above poster is correct AVA SUCKS and it is because it is cheaply made and that is why you Carl buy it.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

I've seen and heard Audio by Van Alstine gear at a college friends home and was very unimpressed. It was the weakest link in his entire setup. Lets put it this way. If you are in or just got out of college and bought it, or didn't know any better and bought it nobody would care but it is NOT audiophile or stereophile grade gear. PERIOD.

AVA is Bose grade gear for people who don't know any better or cannot at the time afford better.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!
CECE
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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Absolute Sound liked the AVA OmegaStar DAC in 2002 Golden ear whatever that is worth. So how can such different opinions exist? Maybe it's all nonsense.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Close down this one, didn't this start out about WADIA? Shut it wdown. eeessshhh. And I don't like BLUE M&M's.

pearsall001
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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

It's a shame that this thread is now focused on attacking Carl & trashing Frank Van Alstine & his products. I don't know about you, but I think the original poster is in a world of trouble having spent $20k on a CD player & can't get any customer service from Wadia. Barely a peep about that problem... nah...just go to pg 27 of The Audio Critic & read a very dubious review. I guess everyone skipped over the initial column titled "The 10 Biggest Lies in Audio". That article pretty much goes totally against the grain of what probably all of you believe. I especially liked the one about tubes, now if you believe the remark the TAC spews about the use of tubes then you can believe the review of Frank's DAC. I find them both laughable. If you know anything about business you understand how hard it is for a small business owner to keep their doors open. If you don't have an excellent product that people keep coming back for, well...you're shuting your doors very quickly. Frank's doors have been open for about 40 years now. Apparently he's making some pretty darn good stuff!!!

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

That is so funny! Take a crap on the thread shift then join the crowd. And in a single paragraph.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Lamont Sanford, right on!

pearsall001, if you read the posts from the beginning you would see why the posts migrated toward Carl. Carl attacked the design of the $20k Wadia player, $100k turn tables, 301 and immediately began to advertise for Frank Van Alstine. Wadia makes some pretty good gear, and NO I don't own any of it either. I feel for the original complainant. However the forum will not bring a remedy for the gentleman.

NOW IF YOU CAN READ, you can figure the rest out.

And while you are at it, while the 10 great myths holds some ground I would say that Carl does NOT. I think the review of the product stands for what it is. We read Carl's advertisements day in and day out and we would like some of it toned down. Every query for a component does not immediately require an answer for Audio by Van Alstine or Legacy. And if we are to take Carl's advertising then it is only natural that dirt is going to fly in the other direction when it comes up, because after all Carl makes us aware of how great and faultless the AVA and Legacy gear is day-in day-out.

A review at a place and time by a magazine of a product produced by Frank Van Alstine is a review and it stands as that. We didn't write it. Carl can quit pushing the AVA gear because for the most part we are fed up with reading about the CRAP.

Carl knows little to nothing about systems. Over the past couple of weeks we have seen him complain that we asked what he knew given the fact that he makes so many recommendations regarding two companies. Carl's response was that he knew nothing and that it should not matter in his ability to recommend components. Go figure!

If you don't like high end gear and what it costs then get the heck out of here and take Carl with you.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

I take it you're still studying for your GED???

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

As a matter of fact I've got three degrees. And I see you're another jerk from NJ.

Now who is screwing up the original thread?

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Wadia didn't exist while AVA was making stuff, and AVA still exists as Wadia trys to come back from being OOB. Hows Audio Alchemy doing? How's Sonic Frontiers? How's Threshhold, and on and on Very few audio companies survive that long maybe McIntosh, how many old audio comapies that make it. Even Marantz needed to be turned into D&M to keep going. AVA keeps chugging along, making great stuff, for mere mortals. Absoulute Sound gave him a golden Ear for his DAC. Now back to Wadia, where are they assembled, how is that customer service, well, according to this thread, lack of customer service for HOW MANY BUCKS?!!! Wow, now that's high end realitys!!! Keep buying high quality stuff from those high quality companies. But then this is audio, where perception, beats reality.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

I like lotsa other stuff. Never stuff that is absurdly priced, and under performs..let's list them just a few, seems Wadia for $20K!!! Doesn't appear to wanna help out with this issue, $20K is a LOT of money for a CD player, lot of money for any home audio component. Anything can fail, but you would expect a better resposnse from the mfg. Why did they go under some time ago anyway? EMM LABS seems like something to my liking, I do have a BenchMark DAC1, cool unit, I do have a VPI TT, works fine. My experiences with other brands have been similar. Yes, there are lotsa brands besides AVA and Legacy, they are just two superb products, priced for mere mortals, that give superb high end performance. Wadia doesn't appear to be no McIntosh as far as service goes now does it. And I think McIntosh has that 3 piece pre amp setup, which is nonsense, so how can I have it both ways?

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

3 degrees!!! Cool. Now about that Wadia service....

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Listen Carl, you can run your mouth to anyone, which is generally what you do but it will NOT change the poor Audio by Van Alstine review until another review has been done on the product by a better source, which proves that the gear is better than previously reviewed. Talking sh*t to anyone here doesn't change the facts.

Until the time that another review is out I would lay low with you shilling or people are going to leverage the review against you to keep you quiet. You've been telling us for YEARS that the gear is great Carl. You've been debunked and cheap sh*tty gear is NO better than expensive sh*tty gear.

You've made you're bed now lie in it.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!


Quote:
Listen Carl, you can run your mouth to anyone, which is generally what you do but it will NOT change the poor Audio by Van Alstine review until another review has been done on the product by a better source, which proves that the gear is better than previously reviewed. Talking sh*t to anyone here doesn't change the facts.

Until the time that another review is out I would lay low with you shilling or people are going to leverage the review against you to keep you quiet. You've been telling us for YEARS that the gear is great Carl. You've been debunked and cheap sh*tty gear is NO better than expensive sh*tty gear.

You've made you're bed now lie in it.

I think you inadvertently posted that, "cheap sh*tty gear is NO better than expensive sh*tty gear." But, if you reversed that statement it would mean the same thing.


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How can he see he's got flies in his eyes if he's got flies in his eyes ? Catch-22

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

The Absolute Sound review of the OmegaStar DAC, they gave it "Golden Ear" award...like they give to some super expensive stuff out there. Of course you can ignore that review.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Afford better? Have you seen the price of BLOSE? The stuff is hardly inexpensive is it? But with teh proper wires on teh AC line, I think BLOSE could notch up a bit, don't ya think? And put the BLOSE wave on some magic wood blocks, damn, it's getting better and better.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!


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The Absolute Sound review of the OmegaStar DAC, they gave it "Golden Ear" award...like they give to some super expensive stuff out there. Of course you can ignore that review.

Carl, why haven't you posted the link to that review here in the forums yet? Do we have to go and find the review now that you've told us about it? Why must I help you reply don't you know how this works Carl? You are in the big leagues now Carl. You shill these components and should know what reviews have been done and have a typed copy right next to you at home. You should have links to all the related high quality magazine reviews on the Internet that are of any use.

You're rebuttal should have been the link to the story in support of the DAC when 301 initially posted the link to the 1st review yesterday or the day before.

If you do NOT know what you are doing in these forums Carl you should reconsider being here. It is not all about Carl having FUN. You are slamming other people's products and manufacturers and it is going to get a bit nasty every now and then. If you don't want people in your face it is very easy. Quit posting such hurtful things about other people's products. We are here to discuss those very products and don't want you continuously demolishing those products.

Otherwise we are going to keep posting links to the reviews that are not very flattering to your favorite products. Capisce?

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Discussion of AVA gear

DUP, don't lay low and say whatever you want. Don't give in to these guy's pathetic attempts to silence you.

I find it interesting that people that read Steeophile and have respect for subjectivism would give any credence to the Audio Critic.

The Absolute Sound did give a golden ear to the AVA Dac.
And No I wont post the link , look for yourself .

At least DUP doesn't resort to name calling and personal attacks on forum members.

I find it shallow that some people here automatically equate price with quality.

There is a lot of audiophile gear that is not expensive.

BTW, my system is around 50,000 so don't bother calling me a cheapskate.

The attacks on DUP and AVA are much more boring than DUP's posts. At least DUP has a sense of humor. You guys should try to get one.

Signed, sick of boring DUP bashers

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Okie dokie Boss. I like lotsa stuff, just not teh ones that are RETARDED!!! Tascam makes some great stuff, Marantz, VPI, Senheiser, Shure, JBL lotsa Harman stuff, so much good stuff...it's those BIZZARE nutty stuff, like a $45K CD only player in 3 chassis!!! Miswired from the factory, ya know a $45K car miswired from the factory is called a RECALL!!!! Yet in Bizzaro world of audio it's called it sound great....I relaly like it. Thank the world of audio for MEASUREMENTS and JA with some science in his words.....$45K!!! I think that thing is gonna sell a lot of EMMLABS single chassis players!!!! CDSA-SE real inovative modern ckts, not obsolete 20 year old not made anymore, what a hoot!!! So much great stuff, so much nonsense, it's a PARTY

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!


Quote:
Wadia didn't exist while AVA was making stuff, and AVA still exists as Wadia trys to come back from being OOB. Hows Audio Alchemy doing? How's Sonic Frontiers? How's Threshhold, and on and on Very few audio companies survive that long maybe McIntosh, how many old audio comapies that make it. Even Marantz needed to be turned into D&M to keep going. AVA keeps chugging along, making great stuff, for mere mortals. Absoulute Sound gave him a golden Ear for his DAC. Now back to Wadia, where are they assembled, how is that customer service, well, according to this thread, lack of customer service for HOW MANY BUCKS?!!! Wow, now that's high end realitys!!! Keep buying high quality stuff from those high quality companies. But then this is audio, where perception, beats reality.

DUP, first off, it is much easier to stay in business when you are selling 100-500 buck stuff than 5 grand stuff.

Secondly, sometimes good companies go out of business.

3rdly. Sometimes they go under because shills are out there knocking them with misinformation, while supporting and/or advertising their client.

I don't know how many times I have seen shills cleverly at work knocking someone's product (one without ever hearing it) while supporting their clients.
I mean one actually stated he hadn't heard the product he was critizing. Pretty clumpsy, but I bet it worked.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!


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The Absolute Sound review of the OmegaStar DAC, they gave it "Golden Ear" award...like they give to some super expensive stuff out there. Of course you can ignore that review.

Specs are specs, right DUP? Or are you abandoning your position because your support of AVA is more important??

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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

I think you have to see others points of view.

"DUP, don't lay low and say whatever you want. Don't give in to these guy's pathetic attempts to silence you."

>DUP has been pushing AVA and Legacy gear for quite a while, while putting down other brands. We just offered equal time to his products.

"I find it interesting that people that read Steeophile and have respect for subjectivism would give any credence to the Audio Critic."

>So how do you refute the facts brought out by the audio critic?? If something measures good, it can sound either good or bad. If something measures bad, it cannot sound the best.

"The Absolute Sound did give a golden ear to the AVA Dac.
And No I wont post the link , look for yourself ."

>Did they do any measurements?? No measurements? Maybe that is why DUP didn't provide a link? He couldn't refute the measurements.

"At least DUP doesn't resort to name calling and personal attacks on forum members."

>Oh really? Hmmmmmmmmm.

"I find it shallow that some people here automatically equate price with quality.'

>What percentage?

"There is a lot of audiophile gear that is not expensive."

>Problem is the specs are not that good.

"The attacks on DUP and AVA are much more boring than DUP's posts. At least DUP has a sense of humor. You guys should try to get one."

>Anything to push DUP's agenda and attacks on products and us, right??? What he gives, that he receives.

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Re: Discussion of AVA gear


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DUP, don't lay low and say whatever you want. Don't give in to these guy's pathetic attempts to silence you.


Carl does not have to lay low, I misspoke. What Carl and you have to realize is that there are people here who prefer other equipment brands than Legacy and AVA. That is fair isn't it? And given that when Carl pushes or shills the gear he likes to us he can expect that from time to time others will refute any and all claims that Carl has for the gear he advertises.

And there is a review of the gear that was at the center of the initial argument right here on page 27:
http://www.theaudiocritic.com/back_issues/The_Audio_Critic_26_r.pdf


Quote:
I find it interesting that people that read Steeophile and have respect for subjectivism would give any credence to the Audio Critic.


I think you are mistaken. Stereophile IS the perfect middle ground between the Audio Critic and The Absolute Sound. Stereophile reviews include both subjective and objective or quantitative data to help readers understand how a product works. The Audio Critic review that you are having a problem with would be like bashing a review written by JA here at Stereophile, containing the measured performance of a piece of gear. There are many types of people here at Stereophile reading. I want to read what the subjective review says but will not buy the gear if the quantitative review comes off bad. JAs work is one of the best components to the Stereophile magazine.


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The Absolute Sound did give a golden ear to the AVA Dac. And No I wont post the link , look for yourself .


Then you do a disservice to the gear you support. We don't care.


Quote:
At least DUP doesn't resort to name calling and personal attacks on forum members.


Carl Engebretsen is one of if not the most irrational and discompassionate people that I know of and I read many forums. Carl has mashed hundreds of posts and people that want to talk about their gear or get information regarding gear. He does it several times a day. Carl is one of the most aggravating persons with regard to audio equipment because he never lets anyone talk about the gear they want without a smart alick remark or bashing the gear. Carl attracts the attention he is getting. We are here to talk about all different types of gear. Carl does not get to pick the limits of what we can talk about with regard to price, quality, type, manufacture, whatever. But the reason why Carl is getting it handed to him is because he bashes a LOT of gear the rest of us like to discuss and read about. The gear that Carl bashes is advertised and reviewed in Stereophile and we are here to discuss that gear.


Quote:
I find it shallow that some people here automatically equate price with quality.


Nobody here that I know of equated price with quality. In fact the AVA component that reviewed so poorly at the Audio Critic costs nearly the same as a very well made component, the Benchmark DAC-1.


Quote:
BTW, my system is around 50,000 so don't bother calling me a cheapskate.


I doubt it and don't really care.

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!

Yup, specs is specs. .01% distortion things like 800V/uS....these are a few of my favorite things. the losu review of the Omega IV, is not what i have experienced on even an earlier unit Omega III, now traded in and using Ultra DAC. I'm telling ya, that unit AC wrote about was most likely not from AVA. How can AVA control what happens to stuff after it's out of his hands, sold to someone. find out from AVA, instead of railing on me about that thing. I can assure you, that review is not what AVA is all about. I've been using his stuff for over a decade many different models, never ever has there been an issue of things the AC dude talks about. avahifi@comcast.net ask Frank what he says about this OLD OLD writeup. AVA does keep track of unit serival numbers, he will probably tell you that was not sent to AC by him. TAS did love his OmegaStar EX DAC, now updated even more to Ultra DAC. The things are flawless in use, reliability, they just work, and do it extremely well. And priced for mortals. Like Rane,HHB,Senheiser,Tascam etc. Even VPI has mortal stuff. Now go find that Golden Ear award already on the AVA DAC. And that even was on a not latest model out now. AC does have some great points on stuff, the AVA review is a strange event, why not ask him, how is it possible, and where did he get the unit from?

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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

Looks like you can read about all 3 units. Not just an older model, this will be about current stuff. Wonder what will be said, now you know you gotta be curious. Right? audio vetern Frank VanAlstine, AFFORDABLE, is key. sonic bliss, for less. http://www.enjoythemusic.com/tas/162/

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Re: Poor Wadia Aftersales service - 6 weeks, still no CD player!


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Yup, specs is specs. .01% distortion things like 800V/uS....these are a few of my favorite things. the losu review of the Omega IV, is not what i have experienced on even an earlier unit Omega III, now traded in and using Ultra DAC. I'm telling ya, that unit AC wrote about was most likely not from AVA. How can AVA control what happens to stuff after it's out of his hands, sold to someone. find out from AVA, instead of railing on me about that thing. I can assure you, that review is not what AVA is all about. I've been using his stuff for over a decade many different models, never ever has there been an issue of things the AC dude talks about. avahifi@comcast.net ask Frank what he says about this OLD OLD writeup. AVA does keep track of unit serival numbers, he will probably tell you that was not sent to AC by him. TAS did love his OmegaStar EX DAC, now updated even more to Ultra DAC. The things are flawless in use, reliability, they just work, and do it extremely well. And priced for mortals. Like Rane,HHB,Senheiser,Tascam etc. Even VPI has mortal stuff. Now go find that Golden Ear award already on the AVA DAC. And that even was on a not latest model out now. AC does have some great points on stuff, the AVA review is a strange event, why not ask him, how is it possible, and where did he get the unit from?

>I don't see AC stating he saw parts substitutions, so how does your comment "How can AVA control what happens to stuff after it's out of his hands, sold to someone." apply?

tomjtx
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

If you don't like DUP's posts just ignore them or dispute them. Telling him to lay low or get of the forum is inapropriate.

I am not an AVA aupporter. Never owned it, very happy with my Jeff Rowland and Watt/Puppys so I am not a Legacy guy either.

There is a lot of good gear at many price points.

Why are you so insecure about your audio choices that DUP's criticisms bother you ?
Just ignore him.

tandy
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

Then tell dup to ignore our posts as well. This has been mentioned before but dup won't do it. It is a two way street. Stop being a hypocrit. If dup wants to continually but in, expect us to but into dup as well.

KrellMan
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

301 is correct! Carl Engebretsen is a jerk.

tomjtx
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

There you go again , being rude and name calling with no justification.

My objection is to calls for DUP to leave the forum.
I never objected to you criticising DUP.

Disagree and criticise to your hearts content , but wouldn't it just be easier to put DUP on ignore and not waste your energy trying to railroad him off the forum?

He is disruptive only if you allow him to disrupt you.

KrellMan
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

If you put Carl Engebretsen on ignore you cannot ignore him because others respond to him. You invariably have to read everything.

tomjtx
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

OK, but what is a realistic alternative?
DUP is not going to leave. I don't think anyone can force him off.

So why bother?
You can be in control of your reaction to DUP.
If you think his opinion is invalid then he should be easy to ignore

smejias
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Re: Discussion of AVA gear

Hi KrellMan. I wonder if you're also Showflash/Abysmal/Enclosure, et al. You sure sound like him, even though you have a different IP address.

For the record, I agree with tomjtx. DUP is disruptive only if you allow him to disrupt you. I, even with all of my moderation tools, cannot stop DUP or anyone else from annoying you. Only you can.

And the difference, as I see it, 301, and the reason why I've never asked DUP to put anyone else on ignore, is that DUP has rarely (if ever) complained that other forum members annoy him. As far as I can tell from his posts, DUP doesn't want anyone else to disappear, DUP doesn't want anyone else banned from the forum.

I find it awfully amusing that the people who complain most (especially Showflash/Abysmal/Enclosure), going as far even to say, "I am not here to argue with DUP," spend the most time, in fact, ARGUING WITH DUP. It makes no sense whatsoever.

I'm locking this thread because much of it, with the several posts by Showflash and his aliases, is counterfeit.

Thank you.

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