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Buddha
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October!

Hey, last month it was NAD stealing the Revox look.

This month, it's Moon stealing the Levinson look.

Maybe they can change their names to Moon Levinson, too.

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Is carbon black magnetic?

I can't find any source saying it is.

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Whenever you hear the words "Peter belt," cover your wallet and turn on your bullshit filter.

We gotta suss out this LP demagnetizing stuff!

I admit to some dubiosity on my part:

"...definitely removed a high-frequency glaze or glare and seemed to enrich the midband.."

You've been listening to gear for a long time, Mr. Fremer, why have we never heard you speak of this residual glaze and glare before?

The Continuum must not be as revealing as I thought, or you'd have said, "No matter how good a table I try, there's still that last bit of glaze and glare I just can't seem to get rid of."

I smell a placebo effect here.

I saw it hit mass levels at the T.H.E Show when that magic chip we placed on a CD player would "treat" CD's as they played.

No offense, but I've lived through enough bullshit breakthroughs that I want some more curiosity about this stuff from you guys.

"Some people told me there's magnetic or magnetizable bits in LP's" isn't good enough.

Like what?

So many questions...

Suggestion: switch your AC plug, or switch wires in your AC outlet and see if those things can magnetize a record.

Should be measurable at some level. Comparative tracings? Stick it to the door of your fridge?

I look forward to seeing the discussion about this this latest and greatest Peter belt "approved" product!

(No flames intended, I just want my reviewers to be thorough.)

Jeff Wong
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Re: October!

According to this, it would appear carbon black is non-magnetic. It is used to help discharge static, and is conductive:

http://w1.cabot-corp.com/controller.jsp?N=23+4294967171+1000&entry=market

CECE
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Re: October!

Carbon black is used in lotsa stuff. Tires, black ink....carbon resistors. Chen vinyl records are found to be magnetic, being de magnetized with a Furutech, we has revised science. Yeah, Mickey F. sure can lay on the double talk. Just a few short months ago the extremely expensive TT, was the seemingly end of the pursuit of perfection...but now, it needs glaze removal through mystical items. What kind of AC line cord is on the Furutech, surly it is not as good as it can be, right? Audio seems to be imune from FTC scrutiny. AQ battery biased cords, Mapingo discs, Ayre Wood Blocks, now magnetic plastic. No wonder people are going I-POD, who can take the BS in high end audio. Cable of the month, magic twist of the week. Every month another breakthrough. I know Cabot well, they do Ttantulum powder for capacitors, the wires I use in the analytical equipment they use to analyze the Tantulum, has no magic properties, but I bet the final product when marketed through hucksters, gets some.

Buddha
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Re: October!

Been looking around.

According to the Colour Index International, a reference database jointly maintained by the Society of Dyers and Colourists and the American Association of Textile Chemists and Colorists, carbon black is pure elemental carbon.

The only difference I can find between black LP's and clearer ones is the presence of carbon black.

All the other ingredients should be the same for any color record, as far as I can figure, so far.
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So, would this "device" be more effective for MM or MC cartridges?

This is a conundrum.

Trying to wrap my brain around this is tough.

MC cartridge - fixed magnet with very low signal intensity generated by the coil moving in the magnetic field.

A magnetized LP would probably be somewhat uniform in its "magnetic properties," so even at rest, it should attract or repel the cartridge in a consistent way?

Perhaps you'd have to adjust tracking force, or at least could gauge an effect this way?

Plus, just moving the cartridge through this "magnetic" field a millimeter above the surface should generate signal, right? Moving a magnetic or metal object through a magnetic field generates current, if I recall.

How about an MM cartridge? Easier or harder to affect?

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Also to consider, the Continuum tonearm uses carbon fiber, alot of it.

From Wikipedia:

"A common method of making carbon filaments is the oxidation and thermal pyrolysis of polyacrylonitrile (PAN), a polymer used in the creation of many synthetic materials. Like all polymers, polyacrylonitrile molecules are long chains, which are aligned in the process of drawing continuous filaments. When heated in the correct conditions, these chains bond side-to-side (letter polymers), forming narrow graphene sheets which eventually merge to form a single, jelly roll-shaped or round filament. The result is usually 93-95% carbon."

That's less pure than an LP! That's a 5-7% "impurity" rate.

And think about this: "...polyacrylonitrile molecules are long chains, which are aligned in the process of drawing continuous filaments..."

It's the aligning part that makes intentionally produced magnets so powerful.

Maybe the process of making that carbon fiber arm is enhancing the magnetic properties of all those magnetic ingredients by aligning them.

Maybe he's been unintentionally magnetizing his records with all that aligned and "impure" carbon fiber in that tonearm?

I'd say it's time to try treating that arm and see how the sound changes!

Michael Fremer
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Re: October!

1) Among the people who have heard this without prompting are EveAnna
Manley who said "NOOOOOOOOO!" because she didn't want to hear it (nor
did I) and Ken Kessler when he visited. There are many other
experienced ears who heard it.

2) I don't blame you for being dubious. I was too.

3) Records I know and love but that had a glaze (like Marti Jones's
"Used Guitars" and Nanci Griffith's "Storms") sound far more natural.
Records that sounded perfectly wonderful sound more so. That's all I
can tell you. Had you asked me about those recordings I would have
told you they sounded great but that for some reason the engineers or
masterers put an "edge" on them...

4) Improved performance doesn't mean you were complaining before. I
can tell you 100 reasons why recorded music never sounds as good as
live but we love our recordings. When something comes along that
improves the sound, it doesn't mean you were withholding something
before or that you didn't notice.

5) carbon black isn't pure. Apparently there are metallic
contaminants. I have a lot more exploring to do but I did get an
email from a reader BEFORE this review ran, but after it was
submitted, telling me about carbon black because his dad was a
chemist involved in vinyl formulations and he explained why
demagnetizing might have a sonic effect. I can't go into it here as I
am overseas...

6) I will write more about this in the future. but I suggest you
listen for yourself! Your dubiosity will diminish...

CECE
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Re: October!

It demagnetizes anything ya want, what kind of magnetism is in an optical disc? And not the black one either. This has been ployed before hasn't it. Will blu-Ray also need this treatment? Can you use a green pen on a blue ray, I bet there will be a new color needed, wanna bet? Cu's I'm sure some enterprising soul will find the faults in Blu-Ray. http://www.furutech.com/produ_2.asp?ProdNo=242

JScull
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Furutech Technical Data

Interested in reading the measurements and data analysis? Head over to scullcommunications' Press Resources page. Page down to the deMag's press release and all will be revealed.

Regards,
Jonathan

Monty
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Re: Furutech Technical Data

J10's link

This is quite interesting and has me intrigued. I can't help but think of the debate on the forum some time back regarding the pigments used in cables and their possible nefarious impact on signal transmission. I had understood the problem to be from a chemical in the pigment, though your observations on the ferous material in the pigment becoming charged from the magnetic fields seems quite plausable.

ohfourohnine
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Re: October!

Really helpful, Michael! Just when I think my system has all it needs (within the bounds of my budget) and sounds great to me, you come up with another approach to getting more out of my vinyl collection. Thanks a lot. Keep the economy moving.

gkc
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Re: October!

My Bedini Ultra Clarifier (a CD demagnetizer, as I am sure you know -- I have the older one) works some of the time, but not consistently. It depends on the CD. It works most often with full-orchestral recordings, when the massed violins sound a bit steely, as well as smeared (thick and congested, as opposed to delicate and well-delineated). It seems to work most consistently with newly-purchased CD's. It doesn't surprise me a bit that a device for LP's would work similarly, although it sounds like your experience was more across-the-board consistent, with your LP collection, than mine has been with my CD's. I have no technical knowledge of magnetics, but to my tiny brain it seems that any object that can develop a static charge can also develop magnetic irregularities. If your machine can efficiently eliminate static charges (I know, that isn't what you wrote...), wouldn't that have a similarly beneficial effect? Cheers, Clifton.

gkc
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Re: October!

"...analyze the tantulum..."? Are you sure it's not "tantalize the anulum?" Jeff, don't you dare touch this one! DUP, if I ever hear of you sucking the dustcaps on your Wurlitzers, I'm reporting you to the SPCA!

Buddha
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Re: October!


Quote:
..to my tiny brain it seems that any object that can develop a static charge can also develop magnetic irregularities...

Clifton.

Yeah, then maybe I can demagnetize my shirts. Perhaps that will get rid of any glare or haze - but with my shirts, who'd notice?

Maybe if Furutech made a big enough demagnetizer, I could treat the carpets and eliminate those irritating shocks.

My wife's nylons must also have magnetic irregularities, if I'm to believe the static electricity connection.

Question: After you de-magnetize your CD's, do you subject them to intense hot light, too? Then give the disc a spin in the ol' player and "treat" it with the magic chip? Then grind the disc to better roundness? Then color the edges? Then put a disc dampening device on top? Then treat the bottom with Armour All? Then attach a thousand dollar power cord to a transport to make for better bass "ones and zeroes?"

Most of my cynicism comes from seeing the umpteenth new "order of magnitude" improvement tweak of the month that sucks the hobby for some bucks and then sinks back below the surface.

The dictionary entry for audiophile should be a sub-definition of gullible.

Think back, can you name a tweak that's ever been reviewed that didn't work?

Remember, Mikey should still be using a Tice Clock, have Harmonix discs on his walls, and be keeping Mpingo discs on top of his Wilsons - if we are to believe in the value of the gear we've had foisted on us in the past.

Consider this:

How is the platter of the Continuum suspended?

Isn't it by a giant freaking magnet?

How about we have Furutech measure the magnetic effect of a 84 pound magnetized platter interacting with a magnet strong enough to levitate it?

How many inches from the record is this giant magnet?

Now, I'm supposed to go along with the notion that the microscopic "magnetic" properties of an LP are swamping the poor system's ability to resolve?

He's lucky that Furutech unit didn't harm the Continuum platter suspension.

From the Continuum review:

"The stand's 176 lbs include two heavy, opposed magnetic plates, which levitate the reinforced-MDF shelf on which the turntable sits."

Also, how about that 84 pound platter made of "cast metal powder and resin composite?" Any chance that 84 pounds of metal and composite bits might have a residual magnetic field? What are the odds of it being larger in magnitude than any magnetic field generated by 120 grams of vinyl?

How about the spindle shaft?

"...The bearing shaft itself is a single, massive unit 5" long and 1" in diameter, precision-ground from heat-treated, hard steel alloy."

Any chance there could be any magnetizable portions to a steel shaft?

More magnets:

"...To reduce the enormous downward force of the Caliburn platter's mass while maintaining the contact between bearing, ball, and thrust plate, and allowing oil to circulate between ball and plate, the platter is magnetically levitated, leaving only 6 lbs of downward pressure..."

This damn table is a magnetic dynamo, yet all that magnetism pales next to that of black vinyl?

Seriously, we have one magnet large and strong enough to support 160 pounds of turntable, and resting on that is another magnet strong enough to levitate 78 pounds of magnetic platter, and then all it takes is an LP to come along and mask the sound with it's own magnetism?

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I believe he may have believed he heard a difference. Heck, I recall those great cables he heard that don't conduct signal, too.

I also believe that some people thought they had horses who could count. It's easy to convey listening expectations to others.

Folie a deux is so common to Hi Fi that I think it is more important to deal with than the DBT controversy.

We live with a hobby where it is absolutely impossible to call "bullshit" on someone - they can always claim to hear something others do not. But the devil-may-care approch to reviewing a 3 kilo-dollar demagnetizer should include at least a little investigation to go with the conclusion.

Reviewers are paid to hear things, it's what they do. Ask youself the last time a reviewer failed to hear "a significant" difference...even when he didn't want to.

Audiophile nervosa lives.

Buddha
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Re: October!

OK, I read J-10's link.

An LP's "magnetism" was reduced from an average of 625 nano-Tesla to 577 nano-Tesla with their "treatment." According to the manufacturer, who, as we all know, is pretty much always spot on with regard to specs.

Taken at face value:

A 50 nano-tesla reduction in "magnetism" reduces glare and glaze on LP playback.

The machine seems rather ineffective, reducing the "magnetic field" by less than 8-9%.

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The strength of a magnetic field is inversely proportional to the cube of the distance from a given magnetic object.

We should be able to calculate a bit...

Furutech data: Lp = 577 nT treated, and 625 nT untreated. With, 1 inch or so between source and site of signal generation.

Platter = how many nT to suspend platter, with how many inches between this magnet and the site of signal generation.

Must look up how many nT required to levitate 78 pounds worth of platter.

Suspension = how many nT required to suspend 160 pounds of table, and how many inches between this magnet and site of signal generation.

The values I can find for the range of requirement for this suspension force is in Tesla (2 or ten, it stays in the range of log values, more or less,) or 1 billion times greater than nano-Tesla like J-10's article demonstrates.

A 1 billion fold larger value, at 5 inches for the platter bottom (the shaft is five inches tall) or, say, a foot for the rack suspension calculate out to a vastly greater effect on a cartdridge than the effect of 50 nano-Tesla in the LP.

Would one-fifth the distance, at one billionth the field create a larger effect than five times the distance at 1 billion times the strength?

At a cube root difference for field strength decrease in terms of distance from the magnetic force, those 50 nano-Tesla would be about 1/8th the intensity at the cartridge, or about 5 nano-Tesla.

For the platter, we'd see about 1/32,768 the intensity, or 30,517 nano-Tesla! At the cartridge!

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Extra data:

For comparison, the magnetic field of the earth at the surface is on the order of 1 Gauss.

So, 1 tesla = 10,000 gauss.

Sitting in his room, assuming he is living on the surface of this planet, his background

CECE
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Re: October!

Bravo...Does the Furutech have audio grade power cord and fuses, if not, then how could it possibly work as Foo and Yoo wants us to $3,000!!!!!!!! Yes, I am JEALOUS, cus' i didn't think up this stuff, and then get it advertised and marketed!!!! Can't wait till the MK II model is out. New colors, new improved demag power. And don't clean around your audio equipment unless you use an audio phile rated vacuum cleaner, with special grade filter bags to be used around expensive speakers and wires. Audio Grade approved, unlike Good Housekeeping aproval, it means, LOOK OUT!!!! Keep an open mind and a closed WALLET. What's the difference between and "open mind" and just plain clueless?

CECE
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Re: October!

Bedini is a great MAGICIAN, he manged to make money disappear from your wallet and bank account. The Great Bedini...just how TINY is your brain? Perhaps you have been getting too close to that demagnetizer, it's sucking the iron out of your blood, making it shrink!!!

Buddha
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Re: October!

As longs as I'm ranting, and somewhat chagrined that DUP and I would gravitate toward a common opinion... ...another thing about the Continuum:

If you create a magnetic field to suspend the platter, and then spin the platter, don't you create current?

The platter and suspension magnet are kind of forming a motor, no?

Where's that current go in the Continuum? The platter is obviuosly made of conductive material. Is his platter magnetizing his LP's?

(Maybe he's agitating the dots! *Nextel joke.)

Is the platter grounded through the shaft? But then, wouldn't a metal platter rotating around a metal shaft generate even more magnetism and current?

And would this mean that spinning at 45 rpm, the sound should develop more magnetic glaze and glare?

Questions within riddles wrapped in conundrums!

Cheers!

Buddha
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Re: October!

As long as I'm talking to myself...

Do we now ned to know if a reviewer's turntable is aligned with magnetic north?

Also, if Continuum designed their table with magnetized records, how do we now know it as a true reference?

Maybe Kuzma designed his tables using demagnetized records, so you never heard it the way he designed it.

Maybe direct drive is now superior.

We gotta get a do-over on all those previous reviews.

Same with cartridges, tonearms, and phono preamps.

It would be inaccurate to assume some sort of global benefit from an after market "discovery" that may differ in its effect from table to table.

After all, nobody has used a magnetic standard disc for evaluation in the past.

What a mess.

Also, shouldn't an astute-eared designer have designed product that "sounded right" when he voiced his product - taking the unkown, but audible, effect of magnetism into account?

Perhaps phono preamp and cartridge manufacurers have been trying to compensate, and now all their gear will go out of "voice."

There are plenty designers who "voice" their equipment based on what sounds best. I'd expect there to be gear that took this glare into account during the design process while tweaking for the best sound. How could this effect have been universally overlooked, and all in such a way that this Furutech device is the ticket to correcting everybody's voicing errors.

You'd think so.

I'm feeling let down by every designer, ever.

And if this universal improvement is so, shouldn't we expect some products to sound "worse" and need to be revoiced for these improved LP's?

Kind of like re-tuning an engine to run on nitromethane when all we had was magnetic diesel.

Does this tell us that the Continuum designer couldn't hear the glare and glaze?

Yet he deserves 100K of my money for failing to account for 250 dollar worth of aftermarket parts?

He must have been measuring all the magnetic effects of his table on the sound, but missed the part about actually playing records?

My dubiosity grows.

ohfourohnine
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Re: October!

You weren't just talking to yourself, I listened. You sold me, and probably sold lots of others too. Besides, you had the fun of advancing a fine rebuttal. Now get some sleep.

CECE
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Re: October!

I agree. I think all LP reviews done in the past are probably now invalid!!!!! MF, start over, you had too much Glare blinding your senses. Or start a NEW magazine...MisTracking Angle, where you can list all your reviews with and without FuruTech DeMagged. Foo and Yoo, the new Ying and Yang? Will they take a trade in on my ByBee bad electron catcher?

mjalazard
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Re: October!

Somebody should take a simple compass and place it close to a Continuum's spinning platter and see what happens. I bet it would at least flicker. Also, you'de think that that spinning magnetic platter would induce some current within the wires of the tonearm and cartridge...probably could measure that as well.
What about the turntable motor itself? Lots of spinning iron and current-filled copper wires...can't that generate deleterious magnetic effects (albeit may be too far from the tonearm/cartridge assembly)?
Maybe we can invent a turntable motor demagnetizer?
Just a few thoughts.

gkc
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Re: October!

Jeez. A guy takes a couple days off to go fishing and returns under full attack. Nothing is going to help your shirts, Buddha. No, I haven't tried the "intense hot light," but I shall and report forthwith. Yes, as I think back, most of the tweaks I have tried didn't work. Most recently, I tried something called an "SID," a "sound improvement disc" that supposedly eliminates "laser-beam fractures," thus ameliorating some of the harshness peculiar to CD's. It didn't work, so I returned it, and my money was cheerfully refunded (Music Direct). On the other hand, a product called "optrix" not only stopped the skipping on my Tennstedt Mahler 5th, it noticably smoothed out some of the hash on this old remake. In fact, the effect is similar to the positive effects I heard on those few CD's treated with the Bedini. And, yes, it is obvious. In the most obvious cases, I could hear it, figuratively speaking, blindfolded. Yes, all of us "audiophiles" are gullible, but most of us become quickly disenchanted when a particular product doesn't produce results. Some, I have heard, even prefer the sound of electrostatics to cones 'n domes. Ever hear of such nonsense??!! Imagine! Aren't sound waves sound waves, whether moved by stators or cones -- or wings, for that matter? Do the electrons really know whether they are being goosed by tubes or transistors? I was happy to read DUP's technical treatise on magnetics. I still know nothing about the subject. Both of you could use a trip to Elko. And don't confuse me with Fremer -- anyone who can stand more than 30 seconds of Roy Orbison couldn't tell an air-raid siren from a teapot whistle. Hmph. Cheers, Clifton.

Jim Tavegia
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Re: October!

Clifton,

Hope you had a great get-a-way. I do have a question concerning tweeks.

I read with great interest AD's review of the cables in Oct. I am amazed that people have this level of discernment, as with my advancing tinnitus, per you this might be the time for me to visit Orbison's library. LOL.

My question is at what level of component quality can you begin to discern differences betweek a $1K and $4K pair of interconnects? Does your whole system have to be made up of components in the class A and B categories to be able to do this?

ST makes a case that using better than what the speaker manufacturer installed INSIDE the speaker enclosure may not make any sense or audible difference.

I have heard differences in cable for sure, but I must admit that I have never heard/owned cables even approaching $1K. Many of you have systems that have the resolving power that you may have had great reason to lay down serious green for great cables.

Jeff Wong
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Re: October!

Jim - I don't think there's an easy answer for your question. The first problem with your $1K and $4K model for interconnects is that we know nothing about the design, materials, or if there's even anything different about them, other than the price and the possible assumption that the more expensive set is supposed to be "better" -- unless I'm missing a reference to some specific brands mentioned in the October issue (my subscription ended with the August issue, and I've still yet to track down a September one.)

I think the ability to discern subtle differences has to do with how transparent a system is, and how astute the listener might be. I don't think the deciding factor necessarily has anything to do with money. A super expensive system that has a tonearm cable with less than ideal performance might not allow us to make out any subtleties downstream, yet, the system might be $100K. Suppose the interconnects between the source and the preamp are smearing the signal and the interconnects being tested are between the preamp and amp... we might not know how good the ones between the preamp and amp were.

gkc
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Re: October!

Hi, Jim. I doubt if your tinnitus has much to do with discernment when it comes to listening to music. I think hearing the difference in quality between $1k and $4k interconnects is definitely system dependent, as Jeff suggests. I have never auditioned interconnects or speaker cables except in a high-end system that I liked to begin with. In other words, if I liked the speaker/electronics combination, I might, out of curiosity, see if I could push things further by changing wires. Again, as Jeff suggests, the dollar amount becomes irrelevant, once you get to the point where you want to make sound you already like get even better. I have listened to several cables costing more than $1k. None have improved the overall music quality over my current $500 Audio Quest Lapis X3's. I have heard differences, but nothing that gets me closer to the sound I remember from last Friday's concert. Brighter? More bass? Less? Yes, no, yes, no, can you play that last cut again? Sorry. Not interested. I honestly think this is the old "electronics vs. electronics" as opposed to "electronics vs. memories of live" argument. You get sidetracked. My own rule is, if it does a better job of freeing the sound from my speakers, I want it, damn the cost. If it doesn't, I really don't care if it sounds a little different from what I already have. I cannot imagine spending more than $500 for a pair of interconnects. I have heard cables costing 10 times that much. I think Sam is probably correct about the internal/external wiring of speakers. It makes sense. When I bought my interconnects and speaker wires, I heard improvements in space and "life" over the ones I already had. Maybe I just got lucky, because I haven't heard anything since that tops my old Audio Quests. Cheers, Clifton

CECE
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Re: October!

Roy Orbison is one of the greats, how can you not like Roy Orbison.

gkc
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Re: October!

Because he sounds like a coyote in heat. From my days of living in the desert, I have bad memories of that -- used to have to shake 'em off my leg on the way to school. And he writes musical and verbal cliches. I hate that, too. One of what greats?

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Re: October!
CECE
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Re: October!

More GREATNESS This ain't no 50 cent, no Brittany Spears, no snoop Dog P diddy shit...this dude did stuff for a long time... http://www.nashvillesongwritersfoundation.com/fame/orbison.html

CECE
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Re: October!

This ain't no coyote What a great VOICE!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjuS00PwWow

Jim Tavegia
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Re: October!

clifton,

Thanks for the reply. I think in Jeff's case and with the high level of resolution he enjoys, coupled with the fact that he is using near the best headphones/headphone amps...he is about as close to the music as one can get. I can see where "wire" would/could make a difference.

I do find myself enjoying headphones more as I DO need to get as close as possible, but darn if my Triangle Cometes are unbelievable. To me it is not that they sound like "the best speakers I have heard", they just sound like the best reporduced music I have heard from bookshelf/monitors. With a sub they are very nice.

RGibran
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Re: October!

Jim, I second Cliftons' comments. If you haven't already, do try to give some Audioquest a try with the Triangles. The two seem to work well together. They transformed my system from good to magical with the same qualities Clifton mentioned... space, life and the ability to get the music out of the box.

Enjoy,

RG

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Re: October!

I don't think you need a terribly revealing system to discern the sonic differences of cables. I do think you need to be very familiar with the music that you use to audition them with.

In Dup's case, I think he would still hear differences in simply doubling a run of his speaker cable. The substantial roll-off of high frequencies that he is experiencing could very well be a result of current limiting in his long run of cable. That has to put a blanket on transient response. Not that a reduction in high frequencies could be desirable at those kinds of spls. I'm speculating of course, but it sure seems worth a try to attempt to correct the shelved down treble.

Jeff Wong
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Re: October!


Quote:
clifton,

Thanks for the reply. I think in Jeff's case and with the high level of resolution he enjoys, coupled with the fact that he is using near the best headphones/headphone amps...he is about as close to the music as one can get. I can see where "wire" would/could make a difference.

I do find myself enjoying headphones more as I DO need to get as close as possible, but darn if my Triangle Cometes are unbelievable. To me it is not that they sound like "the best speakers I have heard", they just sound like the best reporduced music I have heard from bookshelf/monitors. With a sub they are very nice.

Jim - While I do listen to headphones a lot (only when I'm working) that's not what I would consider my main rig or highest resolution system. I'm sure my avatar contributes to the misconception that my main rig is headphone based (and sadly this is becoming true lately because of a project I'm buried under -- I'm always at the computer it seems), but, I get the most pleasure from my speaker system, and that's where I hear the miniscule differences and changes I often write about. My speakers are modest, but, the stuff before them allows me to hear all sorts of little things. Hopefully, I'll someday upgrade the speakers to match the gear ahead of it, but, I'm not prevented from hearing changes in the system. I agree with Monty -- I'm sure you'd be able to detect differences in "wire".

Jim Tavegia
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Re: October!

Jeff,

Had you taken the test drive with either the new AKG 601 or 701's? One of these will probably be my next move, although I may also listen to the Senn 650's before I drop the green.

I have used my Sony 7506's for recording projects, but as JA has commented they are not "accurate", but do a pretty good job of sealing the outside elements.

Jeff Wong
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Re: October!

Hi Jim - I've been listening to the AKG 701s almost exclusively lately. They possess a treble extension that gives them a seemingly more open presentation than the 650s or 600s. I use the Equinox cable on my 650s (I also have one for my 600s, but, I don't listen to the 600s all that much these days.) I've always been bothered by the "Sennheiser veil", a sound that always made me feel like there was something between me and the music. I think for all day listening, the Senns might make for a better choice. The Sennheisers have a more recessed sound. Something that's very important to remember when trying out the 701s is to make sure they're well broken in/burned in before judging them. They really take at least 200 hours before they settle in. Before that, they're bright and a bit harsh. I'll be curious to see/hear the next Sennheiser (the 700?)

Jim Tavegia
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Re: October!

Jeff,

Thanks for the note. A little bright...sounds right up my alley. They sound (break-in) just like Triangle loudspeakers...the pair to buy right BEFORE you go on vacation. Plug'em in...turn'em on and when you come back in 7-14 days you are ready to rock and roll, or minuet, whatever. LOL

ehlarson
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Magnetic Records

Actually magnetic records are not completely out of the question. Magnetite (black iron oxide), the same thing that is sometimes used to coat magnetic recording tape is often used as a black pigment in plastics. Black laser toner for example is pigmented with magnetite.

So I guess it might be possible that some records have some magnetite pigment content.

BUT if that is the case and I wanted to demagnetize such a thing I'd run out and buy a $12.95 Radio Shack bulk tape demagnetizer. These work great on magnetite tapes, and should work fine on records that have magnetite (if any exist). If I was doing an article on $1800 record demagnetizers and thought they had some benefit I think for sure that I'd try a bulk eraser for 1% of the price too.

CECE
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Re: Magnetic Records

Since Furutech did all this "research" in those giant research labs they run for sure (probably just like Philips in Eindhoven NL) www.research.philips.com Why didn't their research results mention this? Or is there confusion over research dept and advertising dept? Maybe they do both in one room? Did GE plastics do any work on this "problem" GE is big in plastics.

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