Hello,
I ordered a Primaluna EVO 100 integrated amp that I'm anxious to receive and hear. I have a pair of Sonus Faber Lumina III towers.
Is this a good pairing?
Thank you.
Hello,
I ordered a Primaluna EVO 100 integrated amp that I'm anxious to receive and hear. I have a pair of Sonus Faber Lumina III towers.
Is this a good pairing?
Thank you.
Will tell you if you like this combo. I’ve heard PL with SF Sonetto 3’s and it was fantastic. I’m sure you’ll enjoy them!
Please let us know what you think!
Got the amp last night.
I had a NAD C389 integrated for a few weeks and the sound was detailed but extremely flat, lacked bass and it was fatiguing to my ears.
The PM sound is extremely different, sweet and lush sound signature. My fist time listening to a tube amp!
Can't wait until the tubes and amp are burned in to experience the sound. The speakers like it but don't like rock or heavy metal. I know they are not for that and will start looking for a second pair that can do rock that do not break the bank.
I have my usual test songs which are the usual audiophile stuff. But my happy place is metal and hard rock. I demoed SF Sonetto 3’s with PL Evo 300 pre and power amp and a Moon cd transport. I’m curious as to how your room setup/speaker placement is…as well as how you have your speakers wired into your PL…try playing it with the 8ohm Tap first then try 4 ohm. When switching wires be sure to power your amp off.
My poor salesman heard Crowbar, Danzig, Soundgarden, Type O Negative, Devildriver, Ozzy and Tool lol. It was Tool’s Pneuma that sold me on the speakers. What I’m trying to tell you is give them more time to burn in and when they are cooking is when the fun starts! Warm the tubes up for 10-15 min before jamming them. Trust me! Youre having an auditory adjustment at the moment! YOU DO NOT NEED NEW SPEAKERS lol…that is a large misconception amongst audio enthusiasts except for Magnepans.
That salesman heard an awesome audition!!
I tried the 8ohm and 4ohm taps, the 4ohm sounds way better, 8ohm sound flat compared.
The speakers have about 100 hour burn in, I'll wait for the 100 hour mark on the amp and reassess.
This stuff is fun to read. Keep us in the loop!
The amp and speakers keep getting better and better the more they are broken in. Hearing all those nuances that I have never heard in the songs is something else. I'm rediscovering all that music that have heard through out the years. Spend ours listening and sometimes I'm late going places because of it.
The heavy metal music still sounds too busy. I'm still looking to audition a pair of bookshelf speakers that can handle it. I'm looking at Kef Q350 or Elac debut Reference standmounts.
Great to hear you’re still enjoying everything.
As for the other genre of music, my happy place, can you give a few examples of songs that you aren’t enjoying on your current rig? Let’s not confuse the quality of the recording vs the ability of the components. For example Metallica’s Unforgiven (hell the entire black album and 72 Seasons) is an masterclass of an audiophile recording for HM music. Then again old Cannibal Corpse sounds like it was recorded in a sheet metal factory. The only reason I’m saying this is bc I spend most of my time playing stuff like this. And it’s still fun! But don’t kid yourself, Dire Straights Brothers in Arms or remastered Pantera sound tremendous. More extreme bands aren’t going for detailed nuisances or instruments. They are going for distortion and loudness over clarity, realism and soundtstage.
Everything comes apart when the guitars come in. The high mid becomes strident, the volume is at 1pm on the Primaluna (I like my rock loud!). I have been trying different hi res and non hi res songs on Qobus. Pantera, Slipknot, Queensryche, Mudvayne
. I am thinking of trying a Schiit Loky or Bellari EQ570 to play with the mids. I know this is sacrilege but maybe it'll work. Any thoughts on introducing these EQ's into the signal?
Again, I’m just an enthusiast. I’m not a know it all in these forums. I’ll leave that for someone else.
From what I know about the Luminas, they are voiced with a little extra treble energy for a “sweeter, musical sound”. They’re not quite neutral. A few things stand out here:
1. You’re cranking your tube amp pretty high. Once you enter the 60% range of your amps capabilities you start to introduce distortion. Maybe minor but still
2. I love those bands you mentioned. Queensryche’s Operation Mindcrime and Empire have tremendous recordings and shouldn’t reproduce harsh. Then again I also love Korn. One of my favorite songs by them is “Here to Stay”. On my Rotel/SF Sonetto V rig, that song cranked, just doesn’t sound good. It’s harsh and just not pleasant to listen to due the high levels of distorted guitars at really loud volumes. On the other hand, Slipknot’s “Not Long for This World and Solway Firth” are awesome to crank loud.
They’re really dynamic.
3. You could add an equalizer. It’s different but it’s your stereo so who cares
4. I think you need to make sure your speakers are in the right position related to your seating position. Also, your room might also need some treatments to smooth out those high frequencies. Carpet, wall treatments etc go a long way. I’ve learned over the years that’s where you can make large changes in sound without spending much.
5. It also sound like your Lumina’s are just hardening up and getting harsh when being pushed hard with some Nu Metal…maybe you’re right and they don’t dig that genre lol
6. What are your interconnects/speaker wire? This a hot button but if this stuff was all snake oil, we ‘d all be using lamp wire
You are totally right; the room is a big part of the problem. I can hear the reflections on the right channel, its carpeted but the walls need treatment, will work on it. The speakers are slightly toed into the seating position evenly spread apart like 9 feet. You got me to listen to Metallica’s Black album and it sounds great, I played that album to death in my youth and got tired of it lol. Again, you were spot on about the quality of the recording. Listened to Operation Mindcrime (My favorite Queensryche album) in high res and it sounded good on slow passages but harsh when it got busy. You also hit a good point on the speaker cable… Am using Monoprice affinity premium braided 14awg with banana plugs, maybe getting better quality will help, another one to work on. I suspect that break-in time of the amp and speakers has not been sufficient. The speakers have a little more than 100 hours and the amp like 30 at the most, get back to heavy metal from time to time and it sounds a bit better every time or I am getting accustomed to the sound of my system. Love this journey, my hearing and appreciation of music changes the more I listen. Was driving to work this morning and Here Comes the Rain Again by the Eurythmics started playing and heard sounds that will be awesome to listen to at home (rediscover the song), can’t wait to get home today lol. This changes the way you hear!
Before you jump for an equalizer, I’d upgrade your speaker cables. Inbetween the $5k invested in your brand new tube amp and your handmade speakers from Italy…are sub $50 speaker wires. Many people say it’s all a rip off…but I’d bet if you put a little money into new cables and possibly a matching interconnect your enjoyment will greatly improve! And if not then we will prove the naysayers right!
I’ll take that bet! Start w the big names, Cardas, Kimber Kable, Analysis Plus, Wire World & Audioquest. You don’t need to spend big money but a small investment may smooth out (not entirely eliminate) some of the harshness.
Thank you for the suggestion that makes a lot of sense.
Started looking at Blue Jean Cables but I think better cable is needed.
Will check back on how this worked out once the new cables are installed.
There’s some really good options out there. About 5 years ago I ditched my monster cables and upgraded to the Audioquest Type 4’s. I really liked them. My dealer when I bought my current speakers referred to them as “Chastity Belts”. Lol. I ended up buying Kimber Kable 4tc’s. They’re pretty solid. In hindsight I should have went with 8TC’s. Either way I think you’re going to be moving in the right direction with whatever you pick.
You don’t need anything crazy like Shunyata or Nordhost. Just remember that cables do need some time to smooth out…or for your brain to adjust to the new presentation.
But couldn’t respond. So the cable swap was a success!? Do tell…
This makes me so happy. But I’m sure nowhere close to how happy you are!
Btw crank Mudvayne’s Happy!
And Tool Pneuma & Invincible ! You’ll get a few slices of heaven!
First of all Dorsia777… thank you so much for making me realize the importance of cables.
Did a whole revamp, ended up with:
DH Labs Power Plus A/C cable
Nordost SuperFlatline 16 conductor speaker cables
Analysis Plus Oval One RCA interconnects
AudioQuest Black Lab sub cable
AudioQuest Forest 48 hdmi for the Node’s eARC
To start was the speaker cables. Upon installing them the difference was neither subtle nor minimal.
The bass was way more present and cohesive (had to dial down the sub and I am a bass head!). The midrange was warmer and a bit clearer. The bass was muddy still, and the treble was recessed but I knew this was a run-in issue so I continued to press on. At more or less four hours the treble opened up in a big way, there was more sizzle in the treble which I love (and wasn’t there before) also the bass and midrange got tighter. This made the listening session 7 hours long; couldn’t believe the dramatic difference the speaker cables made and could not get enough of it! The cables keep getting better sounding the more they’re run-in (in lesser amounts of course). And viola…I can listen to heavy metal now! Found a song from Santana I’ve never listened to before in the Abraxas album called Singing Winds, Crying Beasts, by the middle of the song the drummer hits the cymbals just slightly and a super nice sizzle just flies out of the tweeters, couldn’t believe the speakers were outputting that. Moved on to listen to Queensryche’s Operation Mindcrime on its entirety (as it should be, to hear the complete story in it).
A few days later pair of AudioQuest Big Sur interconnects arrived; those are used and broken-in so I started listening immediately. The sound was way to warm compared to the cheap but nice Ramm Audio interconnects I had. Put back the Ramm Audio cables and ordered a pair of Analysis Plus interconnects. The Analysis Plus once installed made the sound sweeter and clearer as well as give more of it, had to dial down the sub even more. These interconnects are awesome and Analysis Plus is a great company with a lot of pedigree in this and other industries. I’m a customer for life.
Then got the AudioQuest Black Lab subwoofer cable, it did tighten up the bass a bit but this maybe me being biased by getting a better cable than the one I had.
The DH Labs A/C cable was in my system since before I got this one but I don’t doubt it does help the sound and I appreciate the thick insulation on it, it is almost garden hose thick so I get the peace of mind that less noise from that cable comes out that can pollute other parts of the system.
Now the Monoprice speaker cables… While bundling up the cables to put them away and one of the bananas came off. Lo and behold the wire is steel. It was being held on to the banana terminal by a tiny hex flat screw, the terminal has two screws and only one was reached by the bare wire which was not tinned making the wire go around the screw. Monoprice states in their website that the conductor is copper and wire ends are tinned.
A good analogy to this experience is buying a fancy track car and installing cheap tires on it! The Monoprice experience was eye opening (ugh) and very disappointing. These cables killed the NAD C389’s sound (the unit I got prior to the Primaluna). Combine crappy flat shrill sounding cables with class d amplification and new speakers and you get fatiguing sound from the get go. In retrospect this was not the fault of the amp but I don’t regret a bit stepping up to the Primaluna.
I’m a believer; cables do make a difference in sound quality and quantity, as well as they do need to be broken-in. Hope not to open Pandora’s Box with this statement. This was my personal journey and experience! I’m rediscovering my music again and even more now.
My next project is installing a Linear Power Supply to the Node and making it sound better but will wait until the warranty expires, as well as stocking up on power tubes to be ready when the stock ones wear out (maybe tube roll next year).
I am happy with my system right now and the proof is that the couch is getting sunk in by spending too many hours sitting on it. Lol
Frosado! You’ve crossed the Rubicon and there’s no turning back! I’m so happy for you. My rig brings me such joy. As a fellow metal head (I’m literally playing the new Prong album as I type this lol) and general hard rock enthusiast I knew something was up. This was so much fun to read and I can hear the excitement in your last post.
Cheers to you for following your ears!