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ncdrawl
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Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

I am a big skeptic with most things audiophilia, but being a sound recording/mastering engineer, I am firm believer in power conditioning products. I have had several over the years, but in all my experiences, none have hit me quite as hard as Richard Gray's.

It started at home when Duke Lejeune(a true gentleman, saint, and builder of my Jazz Modules(amazing themselves)
reccomended the RGPC Model 400 for my 2 channel system(Master Sound Due Trenta/Jazz Modules/DAD Converters/Analysis Plus Cabling)... It was as if someone sucked all the noise out of the room with a vaccum.. tv resolution became better.. just amazing..
So.. I took them to my studio.. We have a B room with a modified soundcraft "ghost" console that is great(our A room has a new Neotek ELAN >>>RADAR V/Nyquist and Genex 9048), but still a bit noisy when the faders are pinged... again.. the noise was gone.. even with all the faders all the way up, all the outboard pegged...black background. it was a real "what the hell" moment, for us two engineers(me and my co owner). never heard anything so hit you in the face different..

ive been through a lot of products.. shunyata, ps audio, countless others.. but RGPC .. the real deal.

at 2400 bucks for my home and studio.. it was a steal. wiped the floor with everything else ive used, and yes the difference was enormous, and easily measured.

http://www.richardgrayspowercompany.com/products.aspx

SP needs to be all over this.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Run by advertising people and salemen, don't see any engieering. And they sell magic wires, never mind. There are several pro line conditioner companys making superiror industry standard devices, I find 0.0 references to any industry standards. Tripplite, Furman, so many others, MinuteMan, MGC. This is an audiophile advertisng led company from what teh website implys. Proof, giveaway, magic AC cords, 6 ga cords, with all the magic ya need blah blah blah. Stick to real line conditioners, from companys that do real line conditioners, without BS attached. Did ya open up thte thing to see what's in there, UL spec'd, ETL CSA, hmmmm? Very suspicious marketing.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

yes, they are UL Listed.

I dont believe in magic wires either.. but power conditioning is something I definitely believe in. The benefits were immediate and not subtle. and yes, ive used all the usual suspects. Believe me, I dont want to spend money where I dont have to.. and I dont really care for snake oil.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

http://www.pilotefilms.com/produits/Resi...ownermanual.pdf

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

After reading that writeup, it's BS. Under whelmed, has teh typical buzz wurds and cliches of audiophile nonsense. They mention stuff that is a clue to BS. If it worked for you, goodie.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

its all good, DUP.

I do suggest that if you ever have an opportunity to try one, please do so.

dbowker
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

This is a classic example of belief hitting reality, and the true believer can't take it.

On one hand we have ncdrawl, a sound professional, who tries out a product and gets immediate and obvious results, which are verified by another engineer. He's also tried other competing products to give him perspective on it's performance. Thus the well-stated, measured, no BS recommendation meant I think as merely a friendly FYI.

On the hand we have our DUP. He never tried the product, has researched it merely by reading web material MEANT to be simplified marketing information, and has declared the entire company and it's products BS. Again, all from skimming a few pages and having ZERO real world auditioning experience with said company or product.

Gentleman, the man is both pure genius and quite possibly omniscient. He no longer needs any contact with the outside world to know all, and dispense wisdom from the cave where he dwells. A Master of Audio Wisdom indeed.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

I use lotsa Furman units, which are actually built to some industry standards, none are mentioned in the Dick Grey site...why not? Dick Grey also mentions how they have a "unique" AC line cord, code for BS is a coming. AC spike, surge, noise is a known science,m done by lotsa commercial quality units, ones that tout their AUDIO specifics is code for more BS. Like breaking in for 24 hours, Warning Warning Warning. Triplite, Leviton, Hubbell, MGB, industry specs, that mean something. DG has special things that don't LIMIT current? Huh, what does that mean? A spec'd unit delivers it's specd' power capaicty, some wire guage that is not correct for the fused line is wrong, what limits the current is the ckt DESIGN, when ya use the correct units for said application, said application functions properly. Too much fluff jargon. Stick to ommercial units, get more for less, it doesn't have the audio stigma attached to AC line power. Protection and conditioners. AC power condtioners are tested to industry standards for lotsa things, I see none of it mentioned, Warniong Warning, I do not see any mention of UL listed on the PDF papers? am I missing something?

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Documents are where the specs arise, have you used some of those specs to enlighten yourself. When I went looking for units, you don't drive around like a nudnick first you spec check, find stuff that is meeting the specs you need, AC power condtioning is well documented, and spec'd. Join the world of reality, it has specs for specific applications. How is DG advantageous over other similar units, with similar SPECS? You can HEAR the difference? Hmmmm

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

So i assume you will be voting this Nov, how do you know which one to choose, have you personally auditioned them? I guess you can only go by what you read. When I bought UPS stuff for the computers and stuff, it's all about the SPECS, SPECS SPECS, it's AC line a known set of SPECS. How much time power etc do you need in backup, does my computer do something different if it has a "better" sounding unit, so why does a power unit SOUND better? They either eliminate spikes surges etc, or they don't, if they don't then they are not correct for your situation, all done by SPECS. How do you listen to a surge device, only in your imaginations. PF correction, measurable with an amp meter, ie. the Furman PF units, spikes, I don't hear any more clicks when something used to turn on, means it took out the noise, didn't change how teh system sounds!! It eliminated the clicks and snaps, also MEASURABLE, with a scope. When an AC unit starts talking bout how it changes teh SOUND of audio, it's the BS alert. With there hocus pocus terms of this or that magic unique AC cord

Buddha
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Elk
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

NCdrawl,

Thanks for posting your write-up. Very interesting.

If you would, please post this in the "Tweaks" section of the website. DUP is not allowed to spam outside of this "Rants" section. If you post under Tweaks we can actually discuss the product without being shouted down.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

you got it, Elk. Thanks for the info.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Spam? What did it improve on? Just claiming it SOUNDS better, and Elk is all on it. Cus' What did it do that it IMPROVED the sound, always doubt stuff, when you smell fish, it might be fishy. Of course DG says it makes things SOUND better, so why of course.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

I dont believe Richard Gray, I believe my own ears, DUP.

again.. im not one of those VOODOO audiophile guys, I am , for all intents and purposes, a skeptic. I do love music though, had an obsession with it for as long as I can remember. That led me to get a vocal performance degree, and to be come a professional musician and recording engineer. I just love listening, man. This stuff is very, very real.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

What in your opinion was changed, that leads you to this conclusion that this AC device, "improved" the sound you hear. What do your EARS hear between with and without this device? I doubt teh doubters, so much BS, in so many products.

Elk
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
That led me to get a vocal performance degree, and to be come a professional musician and recording engineer. I just love listening, man.


Which is why we are interested in your observations.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

What is a "vocal performance degree"? What engineering degree do you have?

Elk
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
Just claiming it SOUNDS better, and Elk is all on it.


You continue you to mistake me for someone else, I'm quite a cynic on many of these products. Pay attention already.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

a vocal performance degree is the same as say..a music degree in performance for say..cello or piano...except my instrument is my voice. thats all.

I dont have an engineering degree. I interned for several years at a classical music recording studio, and have learned the craft by being immersed in it on both sides of the baton.. the point is.. im an avid listener.

DUP, you are insulting and out of line, I dont think ive anything further to say to you in this thread. Enough with the inflammatory speech, and quit using TEH already... unless you are 12.

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

one more thing , DUP.. the improvement was a very noticeable(and test-able) difference in background noise(or rather internal noise of the equipment/possibly circuit noise)

dbowker
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

DUPster:

Wow! THREE rambling replies...guess I hit a nerve. Carry on.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

And this piece of mystical stuff does what? Me thinks the voodo man has invaded the factory... http://www.richardgrayspowercompany.com/products.aspx?type=accessories

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

if you ever want to try one, Dup.. just holler.

until such time, I suggest putting a lid on it...

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Their writings say I should use more than one, as each time you buy another one it adds to teh benefits.............of mostly their pocket. They have teh same line like Ps about their conditioner stuff, like keep plugging more in, and the effect gets better. BS. Ya gots to read and you get a sense of who's up to what....if ya can't sense what a company is up to in their writeups, you have to learn to understand. PS "noise harvesters" and these guys appear to go the same route. It's great this thing does something for you, but I remain completely unmoved, doubtful and mystifed. I'll stick to well documented, spec'd out produts, from other sources, that are in the business of making things to specs. Voodooo is for the unknowing. O' and the few specs they list are basic underwhelming specs, basic min specs of time, surge capacitys etc. Mostly lotsa talk, from an ad driven company. Are you gonna add another one and do as they suggest, cus' the effects are cumulative they say, which boggles the mind in AC conditioning. Keeping the lid on things.

tom collins
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

nc, thanks for the interesting take on the product. dup is a "force (farce) of nature", you can't stop him. too bad you had to learn the hard way. glad to have your voice here however. take elk's suggestion, don't waste your voice.

CECE
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

OK, send me one, I'll tell ya what I think, the S&S audio didn't take me up on the challenge for his stuff. Any challenge I've met and conquered. It's great being right most of the time. When ya learn how to read teh mfgs writings , ya gets a jist of what they are up to, and how they think. electronics products, run by advertising people, is not what makes me feel like it's gonna lite my fire. Look at GM and Ford, run by bookkeeprs, while VW, Porsche Audi, run by a CAR family (Porsche, Piech) This VW is the larget mkt cap car maker right now, smokin even TOYota, Porsche being the world's most PROFITABLE car maker, thus they are buying control of VW , pretty cool. So when ya deal with electronics, electronics designers, should be done by electronics people, the ad dept should not be in on the designs. Eventually is becomes clear and clearer. Get the basics right, and everything else falls into place. checkout some commercial AC power product mfgs, that do real commercial stuff, ya can learn from the pros.

Elk
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

DUP is our equivalent of a two year old, shouting "NO!" at every opportunity, replete with a two year old's deficit of specific experience and lack of understanding.

He's just as ridiculous when he stumbles into writing about automobiles.

zane9
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
...He's just as ridiculous when he stumbles into writing about automobiles.

Setting aside your hatred of DUP, is he factually incorrect on the capitalization of VW, the profitability of Porsche and their plans to increase their stake in VW? No, he's not wrong.

DUP's point, which angers you so much, is that engineering-led companies are more trustworthy than companies led by the marketing and sales department. Wow, that's a hard concept to grasp. But, in the audio voodoo Middle-Ages we live in, facts and specs will always be washed away by the tidal wave of BS.

linden518
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

[quoteSetting aside your hatred of DUP, is he factually incorrect on the capitalization of VW, the profitability of Porsche and their plans to increase their stake in VW? No, he's not wrong.


I like how you selectively choose what he's not wrong on. I remember how I mentioned that DUP was wrong to deny Holocaust & various genocides in another thread, and even though I don't even know you, you intimated that I was somehow on some smear campaign against DUP, making crap up, although I was answering AlexO directly.

BTW: SM did verify that DUP wrote those things, remember? So what happened to your resolve to be horrified at what DUP said, if they were true?

JasonVSerinus
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
DUP is not allowed to spam outside of this "Rants" section. If you post under Tweaks we can actually discuss the product without being shouted down.

Thanks for this. I must have missed this when the rules were laid down.

Elk
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
Setting aside your hatred of DUP, is he factually incorrect on the capitalization of VW, the profitability of Porsche and their plans to increase their stake in VW? No, he's not wrong.

DUP's point, which angers you so much, is that engineering-led companies are more trustworthy than companies led by the marketing and sales department. Wow, that's a hard concept to grasp. But, in the audio voodoo Middle-Ages we live in, facts and specs will always be washed away by the tidal wave of BS.


Hi, Zane

I don't hate DUP, but I finally have had it with his need to shout down everyone else with one of his content identical rants, regardless of topic.

The automobile comment comes from past history. I happen to road race performance cars and teach race track driving. DUP routinely posted nonsense relating to cars that challenged even his audio related posts. (This is similar to his Holocaust related posts of which you were, reasonably, unaware.)

It may be that "engineering-led companies are more trustworthy than companies led by the marketing and sales".

Now if we could just accurately identify these companies. Do you know who they are? How do you choose which is which?

es347
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

Just a couple of observations: !) DUP reminds me of the other ghost in the movie "GHOST" that Patrick Swazey ran into on the subway. You know, the ghost who patrolled a particular subway car and let Swazey know in no uncertain terms. The Rants/Raves board is DUP's subway car; and 2) for those folks who subscribe to S'phile just so they can read the letters section, save your ten bucks and just read these posts. Lastly, a question for the dupster...are you employed?

ncdrawl
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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up

DUP is banned, he got thrown out of the car

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Re: Richard Gray Power Conditioning products..huge thumbs up


Quote:
When an AC unit starts talking bout how it changes teh SOUND of audio, it's the BS alert. With there hocus pocus terms of this or that magic unique AC cord

I am unclear here...do you also believe there is no discernable advantage in having a dedicated line to your gear?

If so you are deaf. If not, if a dedicated line can make a difference, why cannot a device designed to clean up the goop also not have an effect?

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