PMC fact.8 signature loudspeaker Page 2

Second, with most speakers, treble energy drops off as one moves to the side from the tweeter axis. However, with the fact.8, I heard an increase in HF energy just off the axis (in either direction), which decreased as I moved farther off-axis. (The narrow, 6" baffle, with its sharp edges, may play a role in this.) PMC suggests a starting arrangement with the speakers angled to have their axes cross just behind the head, but this aims the off-axis boost directly at the listening position. I had to play with both toe-in and the HF switch to get a suitable mid/treble balance and open up the center image and soundstage. Optimum (subjective) balance was achieved with less toe-in than suggested and the HF switch set to the rolled-off position.

Removal of the front-panel grille enhanced and clarified midrange detail. One might say that, literally, I removed a veil.

The review system was the same as usual: My Mac mini server sent audio data from Qobuz or from files stored on my NAS to the Mytek Brooklyn via USB; the DAC output went direct to the Bryston or Benchmark amps via XLR. To play discs, I ran the S/PDIF output from the Oppo player to the Brooklyn. The volume was always controlled at the Mytek DAC.

Getting it on
It took more than 50 hours—more than the recommended break-in time—until I felt I was ready for serious listening, at which point I noticed that my volume control settings were about 6dB higher with the fact.8s than with my usual speakers, even though the specs indicate just a 1dB difference in sensitivity. I began extended listening with a recent 24/96 download of Fauré's Requiem that I find quite satisfying, by Ensemble Aedes and Les Siècles, conducted by Mathieu Romano (Qobuz 24/44.1 stream, Aparté AP201). The recording takes me to another time and place, and the pacing seems perfect, the singing and playing superb. With the fact.8, vocal details were clear and the ensemble itself seemed alive. The performance emerged from a believable space, and, if I moved forward from my normal listening position, I felt I could enter that space.

420PMC.2

Shifting to an old chestnut, "Yulunga (Spirit Dance)" from the Dead Can Dance album Into the Labyrinth (SACD, 4AD SAD 2711), I was entranced by the airy spaciousness of Lisa Gerrard's haunting voice and the accompanying, isolated instruments appearing and disappearing. Out of that, the sound of the eerie shaker shocks with its proximity and the slowly accelerating drums convey Gerrard's agitated melisma. The fact.8 was wickedly transparent. It clearly revealed each individual voice and instrument in this recording.

But something was missing. It was not the clarity of the midrange or treble, nor was it the low bass in the organ pedals from the opening bars of the Fauré or the deep drum whacks in "Yulunga"—both were notably solid. It also was not in the fact.8's imaging, within and deep beyond the plane of the speakers. What I was missing was in the upper bass and low midrange. On "Yulunga," the wandering drone-like instrumental hum was less full than I'm used to. The result was less warm. In the Fauré, the organ notes in "Libera Me" were deep and clear, but the choral balance favored the upper voices, even though the composer omitted sopranos here.

Hans Theessink's gruff, resonant baritone in "Late Last Night," from Call Me (Blue Groove BG-4020), was lightened, and the huge, synthetic bellow of "Oh Yeah" from Yello's One Second (Mercury 832 675-2) never filled the room, no matter how loud I played it. I continued pushing the volume in the hope of more realistic and thrilling impact. Room-matching may have been a factor.

The cello operates in the same frequency range as those deep voices, and an effect in that range can change one's perception of the music. The iconic opening Prelude of Bach's Suite No.1 in G major, from Gavriel Lipkind's recording of the six Bach Cello Suites, BWV 1007-1012 (3 SACDs, Edel Classics 0016132GLP), is a series of arpeggiated chords. The first long and full tone in each chord defines the pitch and drives the melody; the fact.8 diminished each initial, defining tone, causing the embellishment that follows to gain prominence and Bach's melody to be obscured.

420PMC.3

Over a span of several weeks, the fact.8s were my primary sound source, including for casual listening. I adapted to their sound, except when I sat still and focused on a piece of music, at which time I was quickly reminded that I needed more richness in the upper and midbass. That prevented me from spending much time with orchestral recordings—my usual meat and potatoes—and it tilted my selections to small ensembles, solo voices, and simple, open instrumentation.

I revisited some old favorites, like the classic recording of Handel's Concerto for Harp and Lute with Osian Ellis, Desmond Dupré, Granville Jones, and the Philomusica of London, on a Boston Skyline reissue (BSD 119). The delicate scoring, the definition of the solo instruments, and the strings and winds of the ensemble were clear and delectable here. And I should note that my Monitor Audio Silver 8 loudspeakers lacked the PMC's upper-midrange and treble transparency, and its high-definition soundstage. But the Silver 8s provided more energy in the lower frequencies, achieving what seemed to me a more natural balance.

Conclusion
The PMC fact.8 is unquestionably a well-made loudspeaker, and I'm confident the designers have achieved what they were aiming for. I've heard similar sound from other wellknown speakers that are prized for their clarity and detail. Listeners seeking those qualities will find the fact.8 satisfying. Those seeking more mid- and upper-bass weight should audition the fact.8 carefully before buying.

COMPANY INFO
The Professional Monitor Company Limited
US distributor: Motet Distribution Inc. (a division of XLO International Inc.)
90 Nolan Court, Unit 30-32
Markham Ontario L3R 4L9, Canada
(905) 474-433
ARTICLE CONTENTS

COMMENTS
Bogolu Haranath's picture

May be KR could review the new Magico A5 speakers ($22,000/pair) :-) .........

JRT's picture

Any reader of this review looking for a very much better transmission line loudspeaker at fraction of the price should consider the Salk Silk Tower, at the link below:

http://www.salksound.com/model.php?model=Silk%20Tower

Bogolu Haranath's picture

They use RAAL ribbon tweeters, which are very good measuring (and, sounding) ribbon tweeters :-) ......

JRT's picture

Yes, the Salk Silk Tower uses RAAL ribbon tweeters and ScanSpeak Illuminator midwoofers, excellent drivers utilized in a well designed loudspeaker. The cabinets are very nicely made, and for moderate upcharge Jim Salk will apply a bespoke veneer of the customer's choosing.

(edit: On reflection, I see that this does read like SPAM, but I have no financial interest in any of this.)

To give some credit where credit is due... My understanding is that R. Dennis Murphy designed and developed the crossover, and Paul Kittinger designed the transmission line enclosure using Martin J. King's Mathcad worksheet(s).

Martin J. King has done a lot to advance the art and science of modeling quarter wave transmission line alignments, and also developed accurate characterization of the behavior of stuffing/damping material utilized at key points within those.

MJK's website:
http://www.quarter-wave.com/

Some good info on TLs:
http://www.quarter-wave.com/TLs/TL_Theory.html

Bogolu Haranath's picture

SP(iced H)AM :-) ......

SPAM n' eggs :-) ........

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Bose 'Acoustic Wave' systems use a type of transmission line technology :-) ........

RH's picture

JA: "The PMC fact.8 signature's measurements do correlate with the sonic character Kal reported, I feel."

Fascinating. As soon as I saw this review I wondered if the reviewer would hear what I did, and if it would show up in the measurements.

I spent some time (over a few different days) listening to the PMC fact.8s (IIRC, it was that model), and I heard the same thing reported by Kal. Clear, clean and brilliant high end, but I found the lack of warmth "rather uninvolving."

I continue to value Stereophile's combination of subjective reviews with objective measurements!

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Your favorite Joseph Audio Perspective2 Graphene is close in price ....... It would be interesting, if JA1 provides in-room FR measurements comparing the Joseph speakers with this model PMC speakers :-) .......

RH's picture

I think this can already be seen when comparing the stereophile measurements of the Joseph and PMC speaker. The Joseph speakers also have a very clean, clear sound while maintaining a more even richness in the lower mids/upper bass. Not a "fat" richness, like an old Spendor or a Devore O series speaker (which I also enjoy!), but enough to not feel robbed. That's the type of balance that attracted me to them in the first place.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Yes ..... These PMC speakers have a 'dip' from 100 Hz to about 500 Hz ...... also, another 'dip' from 1.5 kHz to about 6 kHz in the FR :-) .......

latinaudio's picture

Every time I read JA measurements, I think the same: don't manufacturers have access to equipment like the one used in Stereophile? I think so, they must have it because that is their goal: to create speakers with the fewest defects. Most of the time they are easily correctable things, without major costs. "Those looking for more mid and high bass weight should listen to the fact.8 carefully before buying"... and I need to pay $ 12,000 for this outstanding limitation? If the final product is so low in its performance, the final price should also be low...
Bogolu Haranath: now I understand you!!!

Bogolu Haranath's picture

I agree with you ...... At least, those manufacturers should listen to speakers in their price range, before bringing them to market :-) .........

hb72's picture

some electronics manufacturer offer products that tend to have the characteristics opposite to those mentioned for the PMCs, ie I read some Naim amps, especially when "HiCapped" (add-on PSU for pre-amp stage), tend to have a more pronounced (yet funky!) mid-bass, so that a combination of NAIM & PMC *might* gel quite impressively (helped by suitable speaker cable joice etc), also (or shall we say primarily) w.r.t. famous PRaT.
In other words, its the system neutrality that counts, not so much the neutrality of each and every component, though of course, the latter makes system building a lot easier.

Kal Rubinson's picture

Here's my take. I think that most of them employ intelligent engineers and designers and that they provide them with adequate technical support. However, it is the role of management/owners to decide what product they want to offer including price range, size, materials technology, appearance, finish and sound character. The company then creates those products. Just as with the audiophile market, there are different preferences among the manufacturers. Just IMHO.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

May be the management/owners like only sopranos but not baritones ...... Just kidding :-) ......

Bogolu Haranath's picture

If Louis Armstrong sings 'Show Me How You Burlesque', he would sound just like Christina Aguilera :-) ......

Bogolu Haranath's picture

On a side note ....... May be KR could review the new Legacy 2, 5, 7 channel ICEedge Class-D amp, 610 WPC X 7, into 8 Ohms, $7,950 :-) .......

Ortofan's picture

... ultimate transmission line type speaker:

http://6072m.net/TDL_Reference_3.pdf

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Take a look at the PMC fact fenestria TL speakers ($65,000/pair) :-) .........

Ortofan's picture

... the mid-range driver.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

I know ..... The midrange driver is isolated just like the tweeter, which is ideal in a 3-way speakers ...... Mid range is not interfered by the bass frequencies ....... TL usual principle is to extend and increase the amplitude of bass frequencies, not the midrange or treble :-) .........

Bogolu Haranath's picture

You can read about 'Transmission line loudspeakers' in Wikipedia :-) .......

Bogolu Haranath's picture

KR also, wrote about the principles of TL in his review of PMC IB-1S speakers :-) .......

DavidParis's picture

Well, that's a pity. I've been planning to audition and hopefully acquire the new PMC Twenty5 23i for use with Naim electronics. It's clear that the fact 8s are different animals but many of the design principles are similar with PMC's other models. Clearly, neutrality and linear response seem to correspond to a "house" philosophy and may not please everyone. For the 12K USD expenditure, I would've expected a more impressive and certainly better balanced result.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

For the price of PMC Twenty5 23i, you could consider Monitor Audio Silver 300, reviewed by KR for Stereophile :-) ........

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Couple of other choices for the price of 23i are, NHT C4 and Revel performa F206 :-) .......

Peter-PhonoPhono's picture

After reading the listening report as well as the comments, I could not resist commenting on the PMC Fact. I am dealer in Berlin, Germany and carry PMC for years. The Fact.8 is - in my opinion - a fascinating speaker. As all PMC speakers, the FACT.8 is very natural and - with the wrong amplifier - can sound a bit (too) dry. I cannot judge the Benchmark or Bryston amp, as I don't carry those brands.
I present the Fact.8 with an excellent, well matching amplifier like a Sugden IA-4: this combination sounds breathtaking in any aspect. I can only encourage anyone looking for an elegant, excellent sounding speaker in this price range, to try the PMC FACT.8.

Kal Rubinson's picture

From Jim Austin's review of the Sugden preamp: "As I heard it, the Sugden Masterclass LA-4 was not quite a straight wire with gain: it subtly illuminated the music."

Perhaps that's what the PMC needs.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Tubes are known to have that 'inner glow' :-) .......

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Measuring the PrimaLuna EVO 400 pre-amp, JA1 said, 'it has second-harmonic distortion signature, which will fatten-up the sound' ........ So, EVO 400 could also, 'illuminate the music ' :-) .......

Peter-PhonoPhono's picture

I agree, a Sugden might not be the most neutral amplifier on earth - but also far away from coloring. A Sugden will make many (most?) speakers sing, which is what most listeners love.
We also use a lot of valve amps as partners for PMC , i.e. EAR Yoshino, Air Tight, Mastersound. Many 'british' amplifiers (Rega, Croft and others) also go well with PMC. All those amps might play a tiny little bit on the sweater side.
I don't think, the Fact.8 is a critical speaker. However, it will immediatedly show wrong system matching (as it should do with this price tag!).

JRT's picture

What this overly flawed loudspeaker really needs is a complete redesign, not just a pairing with a boutique amplifier that cascades another set of sound defects onto the highly flawed electroacoustic transfer function.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

If we add active or passive subwoofer(s), that could help for this model PMC speakers ....... The crossover could be set around 160 Hz with the subwoofer(s) ........That could help in the bass, upper bass and lower midrange regions ........ Of course, that would add to the total cost of the system ..... PMC makes some TL subwoofers, BTW :-) .......

JRT's picture

There are better loudspeakers available at much lower price point, and there are very much better loudspeakers available at similar price point.

I would argue that it would be better to choose something else, regardless any consideration of subwoofers.

And perhaps the money saved by choosing something better at a lower price point might free up some budget to pay for a good low frequency subsystem. For example, you can get an SVS SB16 Ultra powered subwoofer for $2.0k or two for $3.8k. Those are relatively well designed with good performance from a retail product at the price point.

https://www.svsound.com/products/sb16-ultra

https://www.svsound.com/products/dual-sb16-ultra

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Yes ...... Q Concept 500 which I mentioned, see below ....... Another choice is Revel Performa F228Be, $10K, which KR reviewed ...... There may not be a need for subwoofers for the Revels :-) .......

JRT's picture

Modal response of the room around and below Schroeder frequency, more specifically the interference from associated Eigentones, can sometimes be exacerbated by full range loudspeakers with positioning optimized for good performance above the Schroeder frequency.

In more plain English, the locations and positioning good for the spectrum of sound radiation from tweeters and small midwoofers might not be good at the much longer wavelengths of subwoofer frequencies which excite standing waves in the room (room modes) at low frequencies, sub-Schroeder spectrum where that causes very audible interference problems.

That modal response might be improved, the problems ameliorated with use of a well designed separate low frequency subsystem using multiple subwoofers suitably positioned, using suitable processing, maybe using some PSI AVAA C20 active interference sources in room corners, etc.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Yes ...... We can do it either way ....... Full-range speakers with digital room-correction technology such as Dirac Live, Anthem Room Correction (ARC), Audyssey multi EQ etc can also be utilized :-) .......

Ortofan's picture

... now buy a pair of the Revel Studio2.

Quoting KR:
"What's not to like—indeed, love—about the Revel Ultima Studio2? Almost nothing. I could point to the flimsy trap door and the less-than-overwhelming soundstage spread, though the latter was probably particular to my room. In the areas of lack of coloration, integration across the audioband, dynamic range, imaging, and soundstage depth, the Studio2s were simply outstanding. Including electrostatics that can't approach the SPLs that the Revels handled with aplomb, the Ultima Studio2s imposed less of a fingerprint on the sound than any speaker I have used. Urgently recommended, both to those in the market and to those who simply want to hear how good a loudspeaker can be."

Quoting JA1:
"The Revel Ultima Studio2 offers superb engineering and measured performance for which no apology need be made. It is a worthy successor to the original Ultima Studio, which has been one of my speaker references for the past seven years."

https://www.revelspeakers.com/products/types/floorstanding/Studio2-.html

https://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/308revel/index.html

https://www.musicdirect.com/speakers/Revel-Studio2-Tower-Speakers

Kal Rubinson's picture

Ortofan wrote: The $12K price of these PMC speakers will now buy a pair of the Revel Studio2.

Yes and, in fact, I bought a pair and a half!

Ortofan's picture

... Victor Kiam level of endorsement, but close enough.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Not so fast ....... Who knows, KR could buy the Revel speaker company after he retires :-) .......

Kal Rubinson's picture

I retired in May of 2015.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

I meant retiring from reviewing for Stereophile ....... However, we don't want you to retire from reviewing for Stereophile for many many more years :-) ........

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Mr. Kevin Voecks thanks you for your support :-) ........

Kal Rubinson's picture

Yes, he has and I have thanked him for his. :-)

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Another choice for $15k price tag, Yamaha NS-5000 :-) ........

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Adding couple of powered subwoofers from other manufacturers could bring the total price tag to around $15k ....... Then the total set up could produce decent full-range sound :-) ......

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Q Acoustics Concept 500 reviewed by Stereophile, may be a better value for the money at half the price :-) ........

Kal Rubinson's picture

Peter-PhonoPhono wrote: I agree, a Sugden might not be the most neutral amplifier on earth - but also far away from coloring.

Either/or. It is one or the other to some degree.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

Another Sugden model A21-ai integrated amp was reviewed and measured by Stereophile ........

May be two negatives make a positive :-) ........

DA KOOL 1's picture

Hi y'all

I just wondered if any of you will be familair with this vintage speaker and could give me someadvice on their performance.

I'm thinking of buying a pair
#

Roger That's picture

This review basically describes a pair of loudspeakers that perform below what it should, even if their price was 10% what really is.

One can argue that maybe it will sound good on a particular room (maybe the one that the engineer’s used to “tune it”?), but it seems way too flawed to work properly on most rooms.

There are loads of loudspeakers that behave and sound a lot better from a fraction of the price (some were mentioned on the review), and I believe that the Stereophile method of reviewing (subjective performance first, measuring after) usually shows a correlation, or at the very least, helps in understanding what might be the behavior of a specific reviewers room and the loudspeaker itself.

I don’t trust most subjective reviews in isolation because even if the reviewer has very similar sonic tastes as I do, we might get totally different sound performance from the same speakers because the room got too much in the way.
I learned it with my own money (by basically wasting it in the process of bad decisions).

I can now measure my rooms (which leads me to understand their problems) and I strongly feel that John Atkinson measurements are a huge and amazing library of data on loudspeaker performance.

It doesn’t suppress the need of human reviewers (at all), but it goes hand in hand on helping to understand the science behind it and maybe have a greater chance of making informed buying decisions.

I believe that both reviewers were as polite as possible in the way this $12.000 loudspeakers behaved, and all but the seriously distracted reader understood what was presented.

This is also great for the manufacturer if it acknowledges that we’re not longer in a age where real information is scarce, and brings this product (and future ones) back to the drawing board.

I would like to congratulate both Stereophile and Mr. John Atkinson for the amazing contribution on loudspeaker reviewing and testing for all these decades.

Thank You.

John Atkinson's picture
Roger That wrote:
I would like to congratulate both Stereophile and Mr. John Atkinson for the amazing contribution on loudspeaker reviewing and testing for all these decades.

Thank you Roger. I believe that the suite of measurements I have developed over the last 30 years for Stereophile provide good correlation between a loudspeaker's measured performance and its sonic character. These measurements do a good job at revealing coloration, overall balance, low-frequency behavior, and stereo imaging accuracy. However, they won't tell whether a loudspeaker is great or merely good. For that the listening experience is paramount.

John Atkinson
Technical Editor, Stereophile

Bogolu Haranath's picture

JA1's loudspeaker measurements are the gold standard, best in the world ....... Even better than Hi-Fi News measurements, if I'm allowed to say so ...... Thank you JA1 :-) .......

Kal Rubinson's picture

Roger That wrote: I believe that both reviewers were as polite as possible in the way this $12.000 loudspeakers behaved, and all but the seriously distracted reader understood what was presented.

I would like to congratulate both Stereophile and Mr. John Atkinson for the amazing contribution on loudspeaker reviewing and testing for all these decades.

I have no doubt that Stereophile readers understand what was presented as evidenced by their scrupulous analysis (in letters and posts) of what we publish. We have no need to be nasty or snide although the temptation is undeniable.

JA's efforts over the years have been critical. For readers, he has provided not only clear and useful information but, also, an accessible database that allows one to compare products objectively and to see how manufacturers have advanced their their technology over time.

For reviewers (or, at least, this one), the knowledge that JA will be testing and measuring the products that are passed on to him imposes a need to consider "What am I hearing?" in addition to "How does it sound?" That, alone, enforces a deeper appreciation of the product's performance.

Bogolu Haranath's picture

If you look at the FR measurements of DeVore GibbonX, you can find a lot of similarities, especially from 100 Hz and above :-) .......

MikeP's picture

I bet these new NSMT Model 100's are better than any of these speakers !

https://www.nsmt-loudspeakers.com

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