Soup,

Welcome aboard. I wish more women were active in audio and the forum for a refreshing opinion.

You both need to go visit some local hifi shops and listen to as much new gear as you can to see how much has changed and how much improvement has taken place.

Speaker size has little to do with overall sound quality. In fact with the use of sub-woofers prevelent now and great pair of small bookshelf/monitor speakers may be right up your decorating alley. I am not a big fan of in-wall speakers, but if they float your boat go for it.

I would get literature or go to the websites of Triangle, Epos, Quad, B and W, Monitor Audio; and better yet get a copy of Stereophile's Recommended Components Listing and start from there. A subscription to Stereophile would also be a great place to get info. The writers there are usually right on target and do not just cover high priced products.

From there you can decide if your interested fall into a great sounding 2-channel system or if you are interested in surround sound with high definition video. Also keep an open mind about vacuum tube gear which is plentiful again and priced right and sounds right as well. Check out Jolida and AV 123 for some interesting options.

Vinyl is also back in a big way so get over to your folks and relatives houses and scarf up all their vinyl before they throw it out. Check out Needle Doctor and you'll see what I mean. also check out AudioAdvisor , Music Direct , and Acoustic Sounds.

You have mucho auditioning to do and I hope you can have fun and enjoy yourselves doing it. Good luck.

Did someone mention something about old loudspeakers?

You can do a whole lot better than the Polks, for not much money. And, don't let the size of the speaker influence your inclination to thinking they are better. In many, many cases, the smaller speakers will sound better.

I think the best sounding, all-around value speakers being made are from PSB. They work with just about any system and are available in various configurations.

Prices range from about $200 a pair to whatever you want to spend.

Do realize though that to achieve respectable sound with monitor/bookshelf speakers you need to either put them on a bookshelf or buy stands upon which to set them.

www.legacyaudio.com Polk? come on, that's mass-fi there are othjer places besides Ckt City and Tweeter.. or how bout' some SLS? www.slsloudspeakers.com Polk, ain't he a dead president? You probably gonna use a Sansui receiver or maybe a Harmon Kardon?..no i know a sony, cus' they are teh best.....

Hi, soupROT --

There are a couple of issues here. Your husband likes the Polks. They are space eaters, although their black color and obelisk-like shape allows them to be set up in unobtrusive ways. Your instincts lean toward the decor side of things. And, we have no idea about your budget. Or what kind of music you like, how loud you like it, or what kind of electronics you are going to use. Do you already have an amplifier/receiver and a CD player, or are you going to get a new system from scratch?

I used to own these Polks, back in the late '80's. I enjoyed them very much. They were neutral and spacious, as I recall, compared to the competition. I also owned the old model 10's, Polk's bookshelf model. These, too, compared very well with the competition. But time marches on, and there is no doubt that modern driver technology has improved. Enter the budget question. If you can pick up a pair of the big Polks for a couple three hundred bucks, they would be very competitive with the same money spent on contemporary designs. The downside would be driver-surround condition -- these have foam surrounds (the soft material that joins the cones to the front baffle) and you could be looking at some foam rot. The Polk soft-dome tweeter of that vintage is as sweet, spacious, and articulate as many of today's designs, but if you blow one, forget about getting a replacement. I did just that, and Polk no longer had replacements in stock. These are issues that attend all used purchases. Also, try Audiogon, by the way, in addition to E-bay.

Are you a music-lover, or do you just like to have some tunes going in the background? Do you go to live concerts? Do you want to get as close a simulation as possible to the sound of live acoustic music? If so, be prepared to spend more money, because you will end up being critical of an inferior system.

Give us something concrete to go on. Just HOW important is decor, and how serious are you about sitting down and listening to some music for an hour or so a few times a week? Will you accept something big and ugly if it sounds super, or do you want an unobtrusive visual look, even if it sounds mediocre. Do you CARE if it sounds mediocre??

Welcome to the forum. Cheers, Clifton

Quote:
My husband is convinced that the Polk SDA speakers (I think that they are about 15 years old) are the epitome of what a speaker should be...

I think that this post is a lot tougher than most of these replies are leading on. It seems that the 'husband' is going after a 'sound' that probably will not be satisfied by the list of speakers that is being offered. Which, by the time that this thread is finished will be a list of hundreds of speakers that are recommended and that you should go listen to (not very practical - even though most of us would have a lot of fun with that).

Are there speakers out on the market now that look and sound better than the Polk SDA? YES

Are there speakers out on the market now that produced a sound like the Polk SDA? NO, not as far as I know

The SDA series, as many here may know, was for the Stereo Dimensional Array. This was a vertical column of primary drivers and secondary drivers that would produce a cancelation cross-feed signal. WHAT?

You had a set of primary drivers playing the primary music, and then you had a secondary set of drivers (right next to them) that would produce a cancelation signal from the other speaker. This would make it sound like the other speaker was not there. WHAT?

http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/products/srs/

It is like your left ear will only be hearing the left speaker and your right ear will only be listening to the right speaker. It is like having a huge pair of headphones in your room. Or, it is like having a pair of speakers with built in q-sound. You get a huge 3D soundstage.

.

Now, if this is the sound that the 'husband' is going after, there is not going to be much else that satisfies this.

I think there may be a solution.

Buy a Carver Sonic Hologram Generator (only in the used market) from Audiogon (which has one listed now for $100) or Ebay. Since it can be turned on and off everyone wins. (By the way I had one of these years ago with JBL L100T speakers - the effect works. Kind of like a Q sound disc with the system set up just right)

Does anyone else remember that story Wes once told? Actually, it was one of his eNewsletter pieces, Expert Schmexpert, the most recent one archived on our site, as a matter of fact.

It went like this:

Quote:
I got a phone call from one of my wife's friends, who asked if I could tell her friend which speakers to buy. I was impressed with myself. She'd called me because I knew this stuff! I spoke to her friend, asked what size room she wanted to put them in, how many watts her amp delivered (she didn't know), what kind of music she listened to

Quote:
Carver Sonic Hologram Generator

I remember that thing, it was pretty cool.

Feed a Q-Sound CD -> Carver -> Polk SDA..... I think that time would stop, or rip a hole in the ozone.

I'd suggest sending your husband here.

Men are suckers for peer pressure and we'll talk up all this cool new gear and he'll get infected with our disease and need ever better gear to impress the "guys" and then go out and buy some 35,000 dollar speakers and then you'll divorce him and have that whole new house to yourself.

Seriously, though, this place is useful with regard to helping with gear choices. If he comes here and talks about his likes and dislikes (turn-ons and turn-offs) in Hi-Fi gear, we can be more useful.

You and he may even decide that surround sound is the way to go, and you can even build in wire conduits as you build your home so the speaker wires don't look so ugly.

So much to talk about...come here with him and we'll all start talking!

Stephen, I love ya -- but if she doesn't know what kind of music she listens to, it doesn't matter what she buys or where she buys it. Circuit City might be the best place to start. Or howzabout Elite Audio? Tell her to flag down the first white van that drives by the house. Only music lovers will take the proper time to listen around and compare. Now, she may be the concertmaster in the local symphony orchestra, for all I know. That's why I asked. People who don't know what they like, within a specific product area, don't want to get into the complexities.

Hubby wants the Polks. I once owned 'em (the ones on the left, in Mikeymad's photo). I enjoyed them immensely. Until one of the tweeters blew and I couldn't replace it.

Look. She asked for our "expert" (snicker) opinions..."Gods and Goddesses"??? C'mon. Buddha is right. Souprot (I wish I had thought of that name) and her expert hubby should come back on, give us the straight dope on what they expect a sound system to do, tell us a ballpark budget number...

And then we'll send 'em to Wes. With so much help, they'll sprint to the nearest Best Buy. Cheers, Clifton

Quote:
Look. She asked for our "expert" (snicker) opinions..."Gods and Goddesses"??? C'mon.

No argument. I agree. I think there's been lots of good advice offered. And some extraneous and overwhelming.

I just wanted to level the playing field a little bit (and link to one of our other pages).

Hi, Mikeymad -- thanks for posting a picture of the Polks. Brings back some fond memories. I bought mine at Shelley's in Santa Monica. Retail was around $1600, as I recall, but I got a demo deal for around $1200. They were ahead of their time when it came to projecting a wide and deep soundstage, and they were unusually smooth and detailed. I never went for the phase hocus-pocus in the literature, but liked how they sounded, for the money.

The Carver "holgraphic imager" was crap, to my ears. I had a Wes-like experience when I was working in the securities business and my boss wanted to buy a new stereo. He liked my system, so we went shopping. He had KLH-6's, with an old Scott receiver. Trouble is, the KLH's both had blown tweeters, and they were two-ways, so you got an honest 40-800 Hz frequency band. Get this. When I heard his system, Jack (his name was Jack Mann) told me he thought they were okay, but a bit on the dull side. His favorite music was Jethro Tull. There was a place in downtown LA (around 6th and Olive) that sold Carver, Polk, and B&O. Jack fell in love with the Carver "holographic" receiver. I couldn't talk him out of it. It sounded like a reverberation-generator located in the bottom of a coal mine. He bought it. There is no accounting for individual taste, my friend. Cheers, Clifton

I can't believe that no one here recommended the obvious.
The ultimate "Bose Radio" it sounds like you are at a concert hall. Modern technology is fantastic. Old stuff like those so out of date Quads can't compare.

Welcome to the forum Doc, and what a great post.

My concern is you may be in the wrong location for advice on in-wall or in-cabinet speakers. I suspect folks round here are more of the opinion that despite the improvements in these type speakers over the last few years, they simply cannot perform as do free air designs, referencing those that are placed away from the wall boundries.

I've racked my brain and came up with many in-wall and in-cabinet manufacturers...PSB, B&W, Dali, Triad, Martin Logan, and even one of your favorite, Definitive Tech.

I'm afraid throwing out all of these names will ultimately only confuse the issue, and would imagine auditioning the in-wall or in-cabinet versions of these designs may be next to impossible.

I'm concerned about your budget, and please don't mistake this for some audiophile snobbery. Only you can decide what "rocks" and what doesn't, but I just don't see how one can purchase five speakers that will load your large room to "rock" levels on a budget of 2-3K. Good quality in-walls or in-cabinet speakers will typically run two to three times as much as their freestanding or on-wall brothers.

So after scratching my head for a hour or so, my best advice, assuming your committed to out-of-sight speaker installation would be

I second the welcome, Doc, and echo the advice that you probably have come to the wrong place for guidance. If you hold with your design specs., and there's no reason to try to talk you out of them, the place you need to go - and, in fact, they might come to you - is to the custom installers of "home theater". The woods are full of them. Much of what they do is anathema to many of the contributers to this forum, but they constitute a rapidly growing business group doing the sort of thing you're looking for as a mainstay activity. Best of luck to you in your search. If it is convenient, let us know how it comes out.

You might have some fun dropping in here to discuss music instead of gear. We do that too, and always are eager to hear of a great new recording or performer someone has come accross. Pick your genre, this group covers most of them. Again, the best of luck to you and your QT.

Quote:
I am hoping to put a 720p projector/screen into the room: we're building a system into a 'great room' with a cathedral ceiling, bamboo floors with an area rug, and an opening into the kitchen. The space is about 16' x 18'. We'd use it mainly for music from iTunes or internet radio, from a media computer

Forget about all that! Movies rot your brain while music has been proven to be a healing medium.
Instead, get a nice Turntable or CD Player, a nice integrated 2 channel amp, and a set of speakers that you can both live with.
Pour some wine, light a few candles, and let the music take you away.
There is nothing like it!

Sounds to me that you would be better served...

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/forum/

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/index.php

We're going to overload you to the point you end up going to Best Buy but to be practical...

http://www.bose.com/

http://www.onkyousa.com/

http://www.harmankardon.com/default.aspx?Region=USA&Country=US&Language=ENG

This is what you can expect as far as help from this forum...

There are a lot of good common commercial bookshelf speakers all of which sound about the same because competition dictates that. The higher end equipment will cost and unless you find an excellent movie theater's sound horrible I see no sense in going that far out on a limb. Keep in mind your taking advice from a junk dealer as far as this forum is concerned. I'm like the only person here that would throw up a link to Bose. Most members here are way way way beyond Harman Kardon, Bose, and the like. There is "very good sound" and "excellent sound". If you choose the latter then be prepared to do a lot of homework. And I mean a lot of homework so that you can tell the difference between very good and excellent. If you put yourself in the audiophile arena and just go out and purchase high end equipment then you really aren't accomplishing anything other than bragging rights. Stick with "very good" and you can't be wrong. Go with high end without the homework and the risk and disappointment of buyer's guilt goes up. At this forum you're at a crossroad. If you make a commitment and you have the resources then the folks here will love to take the time and guide you in the right direction. Otherwise, stick with being practical. It will save you a lot of headaches and money without worrying that you're missing out on something. It's all your choice in quality, taste, and pride.

Good Grief, No, a bookshelf speaker is not necessarily a sacrifice. They're generally better on stands and away from walls. In fact there are some really wonderful speakers which, by their size, you would call bookshelf. They'll break the budget you suggested at the outset - some by a whole order of magnitude - and they'll intrude on the room. I hate to say this, but given all the preferences you've shared, you should take the young Mr. Stanford's advice. Happy listening, looking, whatever.

We're a little nuts here - most of us anyway. It's pretty clear that you're not the same kind of nut.

I knew "SoupROT" was too good to be true -- sounds too much like the way I cook. The key phrase for me, in your post, described your not being able to tolerate the "big" Definition towers (actually, 'though tall, these speakers leave a very small footprint) 2 feet away from the back wall. And 16'X 18' isn't much floor space. A few high-end designers DO make speakers meant for the walls or corners. The best of these I have heard are the Allison Research corner speakers -- these were designed to sound best flush into the corners, like the old Klipschorns (but they aren't horns and aren't nearly as large as the K-horns). I liked these when I heard them (Allison was the "A" in AR...he is most famous for his contributions to the AR-3's). I think they are around 3 to 4 grand. Also, check out the small towers from Epos. Roy Hall had them stuffed into the corners of a space much like the one you describe at the Stereophile Home Entertainment show a couple months ago. They sounded terrific and would fit your budget.

Whatever you decide on, they should be designed specifically for a close-to-the-wall installation. Most high-end speakers are not, and would disappoint if put flush with the wall. Good luck. And I'll bet she is, indeed, a QT. Cheers, Clifton

Lamont is right about headaches they can be found, but anyone who is researching a pair of SDA speakers for used purchase based on the sound they heard umpteen years ago, may, like many of us, enjoy the process.

As a kind-o junk dealer myself, i would recommend staying away from Bose if you want bang for your buck in stereo performance and quality.

There are many other products in the Bose price range which are of superior construction, and for many listeners notably better sound.

I don't have a bone to pick with onkyo or harmon kardon, they make fine reasonably priced recievers for the Home Theater market. Matching such a reciever, with a well research set of bookshelf speakers should prove fruitful. Of course I'm somewhat green to the whole high-end, but to my ears such a reciever/speaker combo sounds great for jurassic park, and pretty good for stereo music.

Now given your price range, and the plethora of options being thrown at you, all very deserving of concideration, I think some actual listening might be in order.

since you are in Boston, I would recommend heading over to spearit sound

http://www.spearitsound.com/direct.htm ,

They have always been willing to entertain me, even when I brought in a car battery and 30$ amp to hook up. They should guide you in good directions, and help clear up any confusion that might have you spending similar money at Best Buy.

Plus they offer a great number of used and demo'd stuff, so there is junk to be found. Make sure to bring your favorite CD's and if you want, your Ipod.

If you audition at a chain like Best Buy never listen to the bose demo CD's without listening to your own.

cheers

Sometimes what you buy isn

mikeymad - The Q-Sound - Carver - SDA path joke was funny.

My thoughts were that it would push the sounds so far off to the edges that you wouldn't be able to hear them or they would circle the globe and come back to the starting point -only delayed by hours.

As for some of the comments on sound quality of the Hologram Generator. I wasn't addressing that. The unit creates the effect that it suggests - but only if the speakers are set up right etc. As for quality I haven't heard one in over 12 years and that was before I understood what high end was about. If one likes the effect there are only so many places to get it so I would assume any negative side affects (which in itself is ironic) would be acceptable.

Quote:
My thoughts were that it would push the sounds so far off to the edges that you wouldn't be able to hear them or they would circle the globe and come back to the starting point -only delayed by hours.

Nice.......

I agree with your comments about the Carver. I heard it setup by Bob, so it did sound 'good' at the time. But as time went on I became more of a purest. No controls other than volume. The get out of the way theory of system setup.

Cheers

The speakers you husband wants are some of the best speakers I have ever heard. The dynamic range is spectacular with a modest amp. I have several pair of speakrs that I listen to. Large ones, I have an older pair of B&W 801s Very smooth sound, and some Koss 1030s wonderfull speakers that also have some very nice qualities, and very underrated and unknown. But this week I am going to buy my friends Polk SDAs I think they are actually over 5 feet tall and yes take up space. I always liked listening to these at my friends place but knew they lacked something. We matched them with a powerfull subwoofer. Not sure anyone here would admit to the brand of the sub but it is a Cerwin Vega 15 inch sub. It may not be the best but It moves some air and the combination of the two will make your ears blead if thats what your looking for. But the sound is so open and has such an open sound stage. Highs and mids are very smooth. I am truely looking forward to playing all my music again on these. I hope you find some speakers that will make the two of you happy

One additional caveat...if you plan to buy used speakers, take a close look at each driver. Make sure the surround is not starting to break apart...especially the foam type. Get a cheap stethoscope and carefully listen to each driver to make sure that they produce regular sound with out crackels or other abnormal noises. Make sure the cabinets are not damaged and that the wire terminals and any knobs are not loose or damaged. Bring recordings that are well known to you and have them played with flat settings on any tone controls. You have to consider the cost of shipping large speakers and the possibility of damage in transport. Good luck!

Did you guys notice the original post is from 7 months ago?