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geoffkait
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Playing then

It's really not that difficult to make a mockery of folks who twist others' words, misrepresent ideas or statements, make false claims or repeat false claims, or just plain lie. It's also not really that difficult to mock someone who has never heard of most of,the products that audiophiles grew up with the last thirty years. It's not difficult to,mock someone who has apparently been living in a tree for thirty years. It's not difficult to mock someone who thinks he has all the answer but in reality has none of them. But mockery is not the only thing I use in debating. I also use knowledge, a thing that seems to be in short supply over at TunnelLand. The knowledge of physics, for example, over at TunnelLand, where the streets all end at the edge of town, is akin to what one would expect if you asked some guy under a bridge about physics. Even his pocket physics theoretical physics dude isn't much help. Oh, well, I guess I have to play that hand that's dealt to me. Lol

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica

geoffkait
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Playing the hand that's dealt to you

It's really not that difficult to make a mockery of folks who twist others' words, misrepresent ideas or statements, make false claims or repeat false claims, or just plain lie. It's also not really that difficult to mock someone who has never heard of most of,the products that audiophiles grew up with the last thirty years. It's not difficult to,mock someone who has apparently been living in a tree for thirty years. It's not difficult to mock someone who thinks he has all the answer but in reality has none of them. But mockery is not the only thing I use in debating. I also use knowledge, a thing that seems to be in short supply over at TunnelLand. The knowledge of physics, for example, over at TunnelLand, where the streets all end at the edge of town, is akin to what one would expect if you asked some guy under a bridge about physics. Even his pocket theoretical physics dude isn't much help. Oh, well, I guess one has to play that hand that's dealt to him. Lol

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica

michael green
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sorry just quoting your words

May & geoff

No one has to twist or misrepresent anything. All we have to do is link to your discusions and dealing with others http://www.bing.com/search?q=Geoff+KAIT+Fraud&FORM=QSRE1 , and post your own words,

May said "Geoff using mockery and I use the method of challenging their replies"

Hi readers, listening to SRV this morning. Hope everyone is having a good time today!

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

ChrisS
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Geoffy Don't Know Science!

Geoffy wrote...

"Take a cable with a black jacket and listen to it so younger [sic] an idea what it sounds like. Then wrap the outside of the black jacket say 1/4 the length with WHITE electrical tape. Listen to the cable again. You should be able to hear the sound is better with the white tape around the jacket."

Go back to http://www.sciencebuddies.org/science-fair-projects/project_scientific_method.shtml and read where you went wrong here.

Are you smarter than a 5th Grader, Geoffy?

Nope.

Google search "Geoff Kait, Machina Dynamica".

Then, in turn, you have deservedly earned all the mockery, scorn, and ridicule directed towards you that one sees throughout the internet.

michael green
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May Belt an Audio Troll?

Hopefully someday we can get the trolling part of this forum behind us. Geoff says he is a troll and May says she isn't. Well with geoff it is pretty obvious. With May though, being that she is here for the sparring and challenging of others I wanted to give an example that may help May to understand why we might ask if she is sure she wants to associate with other trolls.

Several times a member named David has come to this forum to troll. He's been called out for this, but decided to make another obvious troll remark about me. May could have let this go or could have asked David why he feels the way he does and for some background, but instead May jumps right to this.

may said

"I can quite understand how the ‘contributor’ David could have had some sense that all does not seem to be quite believable about Michael. I would suspect that David has the ‘feeling’ that things don’t seem to be real but that he can’t quite put his finger on what exactly is real or not real.

You, Ron, however, don’t seem to sense anything unusual at all. Not quite as enthusiastic a supporter of Michael as is ChrisS but you don’t seem to question anything about Michael’s writings at all !!"

mg

Days later David is at it again boldly saying Stereophile's ethics are questionable. JA quickly responds, setting the story straight that David is an internet troll.

So here on one hand May rewards David for his trolling remarks, and on the other the long standing Editor of Stereophile clearly hands down judgement and rightly so. John didn't take very long to call the trolling exactly what it was. I would imagine that if others supported David in his cause, several would come forward to also be judge.

reflecting

What I saw was May using David to team up with, as she does with audio trolls often like geoff kait, to paint her derogatory: showing a disrespectful attitude, toward another designers. She says that she doesn't do this yet names other designers by name as well as many fellow audiophiles. May also says I to quote her "Poo-pooh" designers and products when I do just the opposite. She has been told about this several times as well been told a few other things that she claims as not being accurate.

To me (this is my opinion) may & geoff internet troll these threads. They get called out by quite a few in the industry for this. I'm sure if they stopped and turned their attention to the hobby of listening instead of "geoff mocks and may sparring" they would fine the hobby is actually quite fair. They would have also found that in the case of myself they could have had a friend, but when the automatic trolling began from them, they in time lost credibility as "contributors".

If there are two things I have learned by being trolled, an internet troll has no honor and has no shame. They don't know how to live life without an angle. They hide in the dark and wait to strike regardless of who or what they might damage, even if it means destroying their own reputations to gain their satisfaction of disruption.

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

geoffkait
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I don't blame you for being sore

Michael wrote,

"they wait in the dark and wait to strike."

And we're quite good at striking. You're just sore because we struck you. I don't blame you for being sore. I bet your ass is really sore. Hee, Hee We both like striking big slow moving targets since they are easy to hit. Lol

Try a couple Ambien and some ice and see me in the morning.

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica

May Belt
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Not trolling !!

Mg:-

>>> “What I saw was May using David to team up with, as she does with audio trolls often like geoff kait, to paint her derogatory: showing a disrespectful attitude, toward another designers. She says that she doesn't do this yet names other designers by name as well as many fellow audiophiles.” <<<

You are at it again, Michael. Deliberately distorting what I say and distorting my attempt to explain where I am coming from.

I am not using David to “team up “ with. I don’t use anyone to ‘team up with’. I had merely stated that I could understand why David might be querying the reality of all that Michael has said, as there does appear to have been an amount of blustering, waffling and exaggeration during Michael’s postings since he began posting regularly since (to my knowledge) January 2011.

Mg:-
>>> “So here on one hand May rewards David for his trolling remarks,” <<<

Again, Michael. A complete distortion of my comments !!

Nor do I have a disrespectful attitude, toward another designers.

I have explained, on many occasions, why I have challenged a certain designer of room acoustic devices because of how he has dismissed (to put it likely) every ‘tweak’ referred to in the past – even implying fraud against one manufacturer !!! And stating that only HIS room Real Traps and Bass Traps are the only way to gain improvements in the sound. They are NOT the only way and that is why I challenged him.

This (and other challenges) to people who have shown a narrow mind set (belief structure) regarding getting better sound are what I have been involved in – NOT deliberately challenging designers or other audiophiles – per se.

Now. I had not seen the exchange of postings under the section headed Art Dudley until just now.

Let me set the record straight. I don’t agree with David’s posting (below).

David :-

>>> “In the interest of journalistic ethics Stereophile should probably point out a few simple facts;
1- sound quality is unrelated to the price of a component. A properly designed one thousand dollar amplifier will usually sound exactly the same as a thirty thousand dollar amp. There's nothing mysterious about power amps. They're pretty simple devices.
2- all digital components sound exactly the same. This is the defining characteristic of digital technology. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't understand what digital fundamentally is.
3- speakers are far and away the most important component. No other link in the chain even comes close.” <<<

You have called MY challenges to others as – “trolling”. I see that you have responded to that posting of David’s.

Mg:-

>>> “I’m not sure David misunderstands digital, he simply misunderstands the physics of analog. Analog is not only an audio language, it's a physical signal carried by physical mechanical conduits.” <<<

So, Michael, let me ask you. Is YOUR response to David a response ?? Or is it a challenge to what David has claimed ?? Or is it a “troll” – i.e stepping into a posting by someone else – who has stated his beliefs ??????????????? Quite narrow beliefs, in my opinion, but nevertheless his beliefs. And yet you have stated “he simply misunderstands the physics” !!!!!!!!!!!!

Which is it Michael ?? A challenge to David’s beliefs or a troll ??????????

I agree with your challenge to what David said. How about that ????????? I personally believe that he does not understand what CAN affect “sound” !!

Now either you and Geoff (who also responded to David’s posting) are “challenging” David or you are BOTH “trolling”. Which is it ? You can’t have one rule for your “postings” and another rule for everyone else’s.

Regards,
May Belt,
PWB Electronics.

michael green
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suggestion

I think you should lighten up and jump into the listening with us May. I'm not sure anyone buys into you not trolling at this point. The thing about these threads May are people can read, and as they do they start connecting the dots of peoples intent.

For example, I didn't say

"I can quite understand how the ‘contributor’ David could have had some sense that all does not seem to be quite believable about Michael.",

May Belt did.

Of course you were using David as to build some type of credibility for your confronting and painting a picture of this designer, Me.

May if you and geoff (this keeps being told many times to the both of you) would focus on sound, equipment, personal experience, real time exploring and your systems, instead of your focus on others to discredit them or their opinions, life would be "all is well" on the Phile. Even now you bring up Mr. Winer in a negative way. Hey May "wakeup dear", if Mr. Winer believes that his approach is the way to go, so be it. It's his opinion, and he has every right to it.

Both you and geoff develope these fatal audio attractions for individuals that is very strange and concerning to read to be honest. If you or geoff disagree so strenuously don't troll, come or go listen for yourselves. If either of you think you have a product or idea that will change the audio world, don't troll send it or travel around doing demos.

Both you and geoff spend almost all of your time trolling, when you could be helping others or building your listening empires, if you have one to build (I don't know you well enough to judge). Page after page, spin after spin. So much so that here you are now trying to defend that your not an internet troll. If you don't change, this is how you and Peter will go down in the books.

May, are you really not able to step back and look at your posts for what they are?

???????????, !!!!!!!!!!!!!!, YELLING, arguing, defensive, accusing, attempting to discredit

May, noone would even have to read the content of your posting before labeling this and your other posts as trolling indicators.

You bring up, that maybe I'm trolling. Well I don't mind looking at that. First thing I would notice is that I'm talking about my systems, exploring the hobby in real time, referencing music in real time, giving links to others using my products (and others) and methods in real time and with long pictorials of the past and present. I could go on, but I would guess that maybe I offer more in the way of proof that I back up what I say maybe more than anyone who posts here. For example besides the good folks of Stereophile, I'm the only one here that I know of that has an active audiophile forum. My forum has more activity going on than TAS.

So even though May might be trying to insinuate certain things, I have no problem what-so-ever and even enjoy giving the proof. I'm not in hiding or makeup the rules, I simply enjoy the heck out of the hobby and like sharing with like minded people. Is that "blustering, waffling and exaggeration"? May seems to think so.

Blustering? If I were blustering, you would see me using !!!!!!!!! ???????? and YELLING on here

Waffling? If I were waffling, I probably wouldn't have so many personal emails a week 50-100 asking me to tell more, inviting me to events or asking me questions on this forum and my own. I'm not sure but I think waffling would be someone who repeats the same spin, and tries to represent that spin in as many reincarnations as she can.

Exaggerating? I leave this one up to the listener themselves, I try to understate so I don't get caught questioning myself. At the same time I do get excited by listening every time I get in that chair

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

geoffkait
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There you go again, cowboy

Michael wrote,

"Both you and geoff spend almost all of your time trolling, when you could be helping others or building your listening empires, if you have one to build (I don't know you well enough to judge). Page after page, spin after spin. So much so that here you are now trying to defend that your not an internet troll. If you don't change, this is how you and Peter will go down in the books."

That is a bold faced lie, cowboy. All of your accusations and insinuations just make you look defensive and frankly a little pathetic. If you take a moment and go back and review the bidding I'm sure you'll find I've begun threads on a wide variety of audio subjects, by quick count at least twenty. Hel-looo! The fact that you and the rest of the Wu-Tang Ckan chose to urinate on most of them notwithstanding. Who knows why? I guess it probably all stems from your deep sense of insecurity and phony indignation, who the hell knows? Everything is topsy turvy, cowpoke. Me topsy, you turvy.

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica

David Harper
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thread

reading this thread is like going through the looking glass. In this alternate reality you inhabit in which imaginary research experiments undertaken with imaginary gear (me torturing a $25,000.00 amplifier), with the support and participation of imaginary friends, do you take an occasional break and listen to music on a good stereo?

geoffkait
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Eye of the needle
David Harper wrote:

reading this thread is like going through the looking glass. In this alternate reality you inhabit in which imaginary research experiments undertaken with imaginary gear (me torturing a $25,000.00 amplifier), with the support and participation of imaginary friends, do you take an occasional break and listen to music on a good stereo?

A rich man has about as much chance of reaching audio nirvana as a camel has of passing through the eye of a needle. - old audiophile axiom

Have a nice day,

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica

michael green
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being fair David

Thanks for your insight David. So the videos, streaming and pics we're shooting tonight (live right now BTW) at the Parisian Palace are imaginary? Your posting concepts are proving to be more interesting with every key you strike.

As for the rest, here's a youtube of where the party is happening. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBlRJCxAGg0

A super cool hangout, great for product shoots which will be on TuneLand soon, but the house itself is unique for Vegas. Stay tuned, and David well.....not quite sure what to say to you buddy boy except maybe what some of the others have said pretty much. It might be more productive to get a life and stop trolling audio threads.

latest imaginary pics will be posted here http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/t289-get-tuned-videos-lights-camera-action

get tuned!

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

geoffkait
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Hey, thats not fair!

Michael wants to establish a trolling parlor for ToonLand and anyone who wants to discuss anything else or disagrees with anything Michael says is a troll. on any other audio first Michael would not even be allowed to post. wake up and smell the coffee! There's much more to this hobby than getting up from your easy chair and screwing down some springs and bolts every five minutes.

Geoff Kait
machina dynamica

michael green
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As a matter of fact.....

....we just this week have been invited to 2 audio forums. One of them is Paul McGowan's PS Audio forum, so not quite sure what geoff is talking about.

It was great to read some of Paul's site as well great to exchange with Paul by email. It's also been wonderful to be welcomed here on Stereophile and the TAS forum. Maybe some of the other forums geoff is refering to have reputations of flaming, I don't know. I would find it un-fun lol to be on any forum that is not having a good time enjoying music. We have a blast on TuneLand and the listeners enjoy the fact that they can come up and share their hobby with fellow listeners. Some tune more than others obviously and I find that each member has their own unique and special methods that suits them.

Geoff says he has never been to TuneLand so I doubt if it would be "fair" for him to make any comments one way or another, but as he, May and David have established themselves in the trolling camp it would make sense that they would paint the pictures they attempt to, no biggie. Have to take it with a truck load of salt as with any internet trolls.

Well for this camper it's off to have more fun!

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

geoffkait
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It takes one to know one

You know, calling anyone who disagrees with you a troll is not considered to be a legitimate form of debate. What I have learned about Michael is that he mischarcaterizes other people's statements, mistates other people's positions or claims, twists things around to make himself appear to be topsy, even lying if convenient. Everything is as it should be topsy turvy wise, me topsy, you turvy. If you ever get the courage up register on Audio Asylum or Audiogon. Heck you can even post on my forum. I have no prohibitions but i can't speak for the mods. ;-)

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica
I said it would be fun but I didn't say for who

michael green
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again not sure what geoff is trying to start up now LOL

Sorry geoff, but I have been on these forums and enjoyed the interaction. The question is, how much time do I have to be forum hopping or even if I want to be forum hopping at all.

Two nights ago I was on "periscope". Within 20 minutes I was talking to 1500 people and answered 14 audio related questions. I finally had to go, but if I would have wanted to, could have spent all night talking to positively charged listeners from all over the world.

What I'm saying is, the chances of me, MGA/RoomTune, Harold Cooper or Soundconsultant going backward is un-likely. Also the chances of you giving me a bad reputation, by trolling me, is only as long lived as the number of un-happy people out there who have the need to buy into your unhappiness.

You see geoff, all you can do is troll things at this point, all I need to do is ask others to hit a button http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/t289-get-tuned-videos-lights-camera-action or give them a schedule of when I will be live. It's like I have said from the beginning, what you are trying to do in giving me bad press is only giving me relevance. You & May have missed out on the entire ball game as of late. People are out here watching and being a part of other people "doing" and "sharing" their doing. The show and tell game is so stepped up from your approach, that to be honest, not many are even out there left involved in old school media.

Basically geoff, in todays world you are what you promote yourself and show yourself to be. You show a portable cassette player and scream at folks and we show "periscope" streaming, fun photo shoots and mingle with the cutting edge of entertainment. You show me as a "pro audio dude" and we met with the entertainment scene this morning talking about designing an interactive studio and hang out to do TV shows.

If anything geoff, you are helping us with your trolls. Plus if more than 10 people in this whole world bought into the picture you are trying to paint of the tune I would be surprised, cause most of those folks would be dead or close to death or at least retirement age, along with being the same negative status as you. I mean how many people are interested in two 80-90 year olds take on innovation using a 1980's sony cassette walkman cassette tape player?

You & May and other old farts have made your beds and your sleeping in them. Nothing wrong with that, I'll join you guys probably one day, reletively speaking. At the same time though is a completey different generation who look at audio through a completely set of eyewear.

In the meeting today, someone was talking to another (older fella) music biz guy, about how this works. He said picture this. A guy comes up to you on the road and says "my car is broke and I need it towed". Towing costs $200.00 but he says he'll pay you back as soon as we get to the repair shop. This guy, smokes, yells, cusses, is dirty and in general creating and giving off bad vibes. Another guy comes to you with the same situation, but instead is positive, clean, pleasant tone, well dressed & spokin and is giving off a good vibe. Which one are 99% of the people going to be incline to believe in getting their money back from?

The reputation you continue to create and maintain for yourself is all you will be remembered for.

we all said it was going to be fun, and we all agreed for who

michael green
MGA/RoomTune
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net/

geoffkait
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Whew, what a relief that must be!

Hope you feel better getting all that off your chest. I anxiously await your next angst ridden diatribe. Highly entertaining. Keep 'em coming!

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica
Advanced Audio Conceits

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