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wiremanagement
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Money Talks - Bullshit Walks

If quadlover is correct with his estimation that new item sales are down 30-40%, then AudiogoN is in deep trouble. Sales are going to continue to plummet. It doesn't matter how much the "Powers To Be" in charge over @ AudiogoN try to self promote their "New Look" or try and make us believe that AudiogoN members are liking it....IT AIN'T WORKING!!! I am really starting to think that the original founder of AudiogoN has nothing to do with this mess. My bet is that he sold the company to a group of investors who know absolutely nothing about high end audio, who then hired some IT person(s) who know even less about high end audio, who were then given orders to give it a fresh 2012 "look". Do you Goners remember "The Hub"? Now THAT was some great writing in those columns authored by someone who knew this hobby and especially the business side of it......reminiscent of AUDIOMART. I assume that string of columns were written by the founder of AudiogoN. I ask you all-do you really think that the "New Look" of AudiogoN was an idea that came from the intellectual mind of the same guy who wrote "The Hub"? I doubt it. That is why I think that AudiogoN is in deep do do. We are probably not trying to rationalize with AudiogoN management of days gone by. We are voicing our displeasure of the "New Look" to a management group whose philosophy is "Change Is Good". Sheesh!!........we are in trouble for sure.   

andred
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audiogon alternatives?

i concur that audiogon has taken a great thing and turned it into dirt.  new site is almost impossible to use.  cant see sellers other items, cant modify ad (only add to it), cant change price, cant see ad after a buy to see what the ad said about shipping cost etc., hard to see the photos etc., cant reply directly to buyers questions (need to go log in find your item, then reply)  i dont plan to sell on a-gon any more unless they do a major improvement.

what are the alternatives?

e-bay reaches massive audiience, but is full of sharks and is anti-seller in many ways.

craigslist only reaches tiny geographic pockets.

has anyone sold on the new sound ofers site?  if so,, how was it?

are there any other sites on which to reach a large national base of audio fanatics?

we will find a way,but what it will be is not clear at this point...

quadlover
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Audiogons follies

The problem is there is no currently available marketplace/ site anywhere nearly as effective as old audiogon was.  As you stated eBay works for mainstream, antique,and distressed pieces of hardware.  For music it is excellent. 

Craigslist, no disrespect,, is for substandard products the majority of the time.  No one would list functionally, physically excellent high end equipment on Craigslist.  However got a hand me down rat conditioned pioneer receiver your spouse says get rid of it or else?  Craigslist to the rescue.

I am now speaking to the new or very casual user.  After your audiophile buddy has introduced you to high end audio and now you want to buy some equipment pre-owned. On old audiogon you'd select "musical fidelity" and all products with that would show up.  At this point old audiogon's list would be sorted in product groups...amps,preamps,cd,dac,etc...look and touch what floats your boat

 

Not new audiogon...at least as of this morning.  It lists equipment with no sorting or listing of product type, forcing you to look at each item.  This example alone is enough to frustrate and alienate potential new members.  It also makes veteran users angry to the point of why bother.

 

Please,please.please audiogon change back to your old ways.  We loved you then and what to love you tomorrow.  Right now your causing us, as well as you, to have a bad day.

 

Otherwise come back audio mart!

Spurzheim
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Worst site resign I have ever seen

Not only is the site almost universally hated, but the Audiogon mods are blocking and hiding negative feedback from their community

Perhaps they will start responding to the negative feedback if we put it where they cannot block it:

http://audiogonsucksnow.wordpress.com/

hifipete
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what-do-you-think-new-audiogon-site

Like the old saying goes..''if it ain't broke, don't fix it''..some whiz computer savy (but the jury is still out on that one) geek decided to make it ''better''. Now I can't even change my password...when I click on contact...email...I get a page that asks me my username, email address, topic and then there a space to write. So far so good...but when you click on ''send''...OHMEGOD does the system go bonkers. Now I missed a deal because I can't change my password since the old one I've had for ten years doesn't have enough caracters (it worked fine all these years...DUH!). SO, if someone at Audiogon is reading this, PUHLEASE contact me at pcoach@videotron.ca The new site is definitely NOT user friendly. I'm very dissapointed in the changes and I sure as hell hope they don't force us to go the Facebook and/or Twitter way in the near future, because that will be the last straw.

Disgruntled member.

hifipete
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New Audiogon site

Man-o-man..I've just finished reading the posts here and if I would be in Audiogons shoes I'd be depressed and on Prozac by now. WT@ were they thinking when they changed all this ??? And guys (Audiogon) your record skips...

Site is currently in maintenance mode as we complete the update.  Please be patient while we finish this process.   Please Read Before Commenting: If you can’t currently see your listing: please be patient as all ads are being updated into the new system and should be on the new site shortly. If your listing does not show correctly: [...]

So change the tune, or better, go back to the old site, I'm begging you as a 10+ year member of this site that I loved so much. Now my feeling has turned 180 degrees around and start with the letter H. If you don't get your s**T together REAL SOON you're gonna sink. There's another site that caters to Audiophiles which I always rated a bit below Audiogon but actually works pretty well. I now rate this site Waaaayyy above Audiogon and urge my fellow members to join in droves. The site is probably well known to many Audiogoners, it's CanuckAudiomart, based in western Canada, I've been also a long time member of this site and have used it quite often with satisfying results. I urge you to switch, massively.

dave43
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Audiogon now sucks

As a member of audiogon for the past 10 years, it's official:  they've ruined what was a good thing.  Their old format was the place to buy and sell high end audio equipment, but their new site is a disaster!  You can't communicate with other members directly, look up ZIP codes, your offers don't go thru, and they are blatently ignoring all the negative feedback they've been receiving.  I saw the chart of how much their useage has dropped since they went to the new format, and for good reason.  I'm waiting for someone to launch a new version of their old site so we can all get back to business again! 

wadia150
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audiogon is aweful

Ive been a member for a decade now and i have to say the new site is ugly none intuitive and a utter disappointment. whats the deal with response from noreply@ its the same damn email you have to right everything down to keep up with it all. They should have left it alone and charged a member fee. They obviously thought they should upgrade for there two percent charge. I understand the money part but why hire someone from kindegarden to do the website. After i sell my last posting i will be dropping my membership. I cant understand what they were thinking the site has a cold feel hard to understand and read. Words cant explain how bad it is. How do you redesighn something like this sit back in your chair and go yeah this better. A complete disaster.

wadia150
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audiogon is aweful

I've been a member for a decade now and i have to say the new site is ugly none intuitive and a utter disappointment. what the deal with response from noreply@ its the same damn email you have to write everything down to keep up with it all. They should have left it alone and charged a member fee. They obviously thought they should upgrade for there two percent charge. I understand the money part but why hire someone from kindergarten to do the website. After i sell my last posting i will be dropping my membership. I cant understand what they were thinking the site has a cold feel hard to understand and read. Words cant explain how bad it is. How do you redesign something like this sit back in your chair and go yeah this better. A complete disaster.

quadlover
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the new audiogon

Well it has been almost 30 days since I first posted this thread and audiogon still doesn't want to admit its screw up.  Regardless of any claims to the contrary the new audiogon has to be considered an out and out failure.  Simple proof...old audiogon normerlyl had 150-300 items listed in "new today column".  If you look at new audiogon under new listings all they give you is everything for sale on audiogon.  assuming most "for sale" ads list for 28-30 days as decided by seller, the new audiogon listings are off at least 40%.  How long must this nonsense last?
      If audiogon was really concerned about customer satisfaction why don't they address these vocal concerns from those of us that have been and want to continue to be their ardent supporters?
      As someone listed earlier, Coke realized the public did not want "new" Coke so Coke classic was brought to market.  Bank and wireless company fees have been altered due to public outcries.
      Are the operators of audiogon blind and/or deaf?  Or just dumb?

We the people of old audiogon keep this discussion open on this site (and avguide.com) only because audiogon will not respond to our outcries.  A review of the number of people who have followed this discussion on Stereophile proves it is a hot discussion.  It sadly is one of the most viewed discussion topics.

love2listen2music
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Alternative to AudiogoN - stereolist.com - let's go now!

http://stereolist.com

There are still no fees. It could be an immediate alternative if everyone just goes over there.

Let’s do it !

quadlover
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is it true

At the site www.audiogonsucksnow a comment that was posted a couple of days ago stated that audiogon is/was owned by the people that own Stereophile.  Is it true?

If so, Stereophile has a history of adapting to its customer base yet still draw new customers.  As a long time reader (mid 70's) I can never remember a change that met the utter disdain that we the people of audiogon feel about the new site.

If it is false please say so to shut down such falsehoods. 

Too often people read something on the internet and assume its gospel.  Often it is not.

What about this???????????

Ariel Bitran
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No

This is not true. Posted in thread over there.

There is no affiliation between Stereophile and Audiogon.

minimus
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I agree, Audiogon is now a disaster

The new Audiogon is a complete mess. I tried to post an ad on Friday for a VAC Phi 200 so I could upgrade to a new amp. This was after three attempts that wasted about three hours. So I guess I won't be upgrading any time soon. Not a big deal for me. The VAC is a good amp.

I suspect dealers by and large are thrilled that the used market has come to a screeching halt, because they will no longer have to compete with sellers of used equipment. They may be right. Time will tell. If most buyers of new equipment are "new entrants" who want to build a system from scratch, then the failure of Audiogon will be a boon to manufacturers. But if most buyers of new equipment are hobbyists who already own systems, then the failure of Audiogon is going to pull transaction volume way down for dealers in coming months.

I personally know of no new entrants into 2 channel audio. Virtually everyone I know thinks it is insane to buy an amp for $10,000, an interconnect for $800, etc. They don't even know what a preamp is. They think turntables went the way of the dinosaur. So, in the long run, the collapse of the used market is probably going to spell trouble for dealers, as existing hobbyists will just stick with what they currently own.

I honestly don't know what Audiogon was thinking when they changed their site. I never liked how they acted like Big Brother as moderator's of their forums. I suppose the same mentality led Audiogon to believe it could do what it wanted with the site revisions, no matter how disruptive or destructive. I do hope Canuck Audio Mart extends into the US and replaces Audiogon in short order.

returnstackerror
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crap

I havent read all the posts.. I gave up early on when this thread 1st appeared after some robot from audiogon was posting messages on fixes.

I just did a search on "gallo" in audiogon, checking out if any Ref 3.5's were on (this was the 1st time I had done a search since the upgrade)... what happened  to showing photos as part of the listing rather than having to click to see them?

I used to judge what was of interest based on that... for example I dont want an all black Ref 3.5.. I could determine that without any sweat.

Humans are above all visual animals... thats how we recogonise each other... and we can determine many things even with a small image as was the case with the old site.

And when you drill down... a very messy format.

Obviously the redesign was done in a vacuum with no reference to the existing user base.

 

Peter

 

 

wiremanagement
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Unfair Financial / Business Practices @ AudiogoN?

It is one thing for AudiogoN to try to shove the "new look" down our throats but when they start handling our money in our accounts irresponsibly or try to take it from us dishonestly, THAT is against the law. I read quite a few stories @ http://audiogonsucksnow.wordpress.com/  telling of instances where AudiogoN is asking for more money when in actuality the member HAS money in his or her account. Another common complaint is a member wants to edit their ad, AudiogoN no longer allows this and only suggests to purchase and post a new corrected ad – which somehow sounds unlawful to me although I confess I am no lawyer. Somewhere in the http://audiogonsucksnow.wordpress.com/ blog it was stated that AudiogoN has moved from Ann Arbor, Michigan (1915 Austin Avenue Ann Arbor, MI 48104) and is now based out of South Carolina (Audiogon, Inc. PO Box 8376 Greenville, SC 29604). IF that is true, then the following information would be of great interest to all of you who have been cheated out of money or treated unfairly. This is the web address of the South Carolina Attorney General: http://www.scag.gov/ Their web address for consumer affairs is: http://www.scconsumer.gov/ Consumer Affairs phone numbers are: (803) 734-4200 or (800) 922-1594. I encourage all those who are experiencing fraudulent money/business practices with the “new” Audiogon to please get the ball rolling and use the Attorney General’s office to be your voice. My recent search for AudiogoN with the Better Business Bureau shows that they have not yet registered in South Carolina. However, all interested parties could state AudiogoN’s own web site listed contact information (PO Box 8376 Greenville, SC 29604) and at least register a complaint: http://www.bbb.org/us/Find-Business-Reviews/ When corresponding with any of these offices, it would be very helpful to include this link http://audiogonsucksnow.wordpress.com/ so they can see and read substantiating information.
 

geoffkait
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Audiogon

I don't really see what the bellyaching is all about, sure, there are lots of second hand reports regarding emails and such since the site was overhauled and I agree with some of the reports.  But this is to be expected when a site overhauls it's software.  Need I give any examples?  Personally, except for a few hiccups, my experience at Audiogon, which is rather significant, remains good overall.  I suspect that a certain period of time will be required before Audiogon works out the remaining bugs and things get back to normal.

 

Geoff  Kait

Www.machinadynamica.com

wiremanagement
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Unfair Financial / Business Practices @ AudiogoN? - Ammendment

Further research into AudiogoN’s ownership has revealed some additional information that I would like to present as an amendment to my previous post. At the bottom of AudiogoN’s home page (Under “Contact Us”) they list their contact information as:  Audiogon, Inc. PO Box 8376 Greenville, SC 29604. This info, along with other members reporting that AudiogoN is no longer owned by parties in Ann Arbor Michigan, prompted me to encourage members to contact the Better Business Bureau and the South Carolina Attorney General to report any fraudulent financial/business practices they have experienced with the “new” AudiogoN (see my previous post). However, when navigating AudiogoN’s home page and then clicking on “Terms Of Service” (bottom of home page) and then to “DETAILED TERMS OF THE AGREEMENT”, I find this at the bottom of that particular page:

 “General

This Agreement shall be governed by the laws of the State of Michigan as applied to agreements entered into and to be performed entirely within Michigan by Michigan residents. If any provision of this Agreement is held to be invalid or unenforceable, such provision shall be struck and the remaining provisions shall be enforced. Our failure to act with respect to a breach by you or others does not waive our right to act with respect to subsequent or similar breaches.  Audiogon may.”

 This leads me to believe that AudiogoN is still registered as a business in Michigan (as of today’s search they are not yet registered in South Carolina) and that Michigan would be the most appropriate state for anyone to lodge any complaints of unfair financial/business practices experienced with the “new” AudiogoN. The link needed to file with the Attorney General in Michigan would be: http://www.michigan.gov/ag/0,4534,7-164-17331-42077--,00.html

 

When corresponding with the Attorney General or Better Business Bureau, it would be very helpful to include this link: http://audiogonsucksnow.wordpress.com/so they can see and read substantiating information.

quadlover
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audiogon mismanagement continues

As I was looking for a music server over the weekend, I noticed a statement on the bottom of a for sale page by a multi-time seller on Audiogon.  PLEASE NOTE I AM PARAPHRASING, "my email is ...my phone is ... use these while audiogon sorts through its mess"

 

If this doesn't speak volumes what does?

quadlover
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last time to vent

It has been 3 months since I first posted this question here and on The Absolute Sound's site.  So far the comments are overwhelmingly against the new site.  There have been SOME changes but they are few and far between.  They have hardly attempted to fix the core problem...the new site is just a mess.  

To change, update or modify  a site isn't like designing an automobile where, if the new version isn't well received, it takes a year or 2 to correct or update.  A site can be changed in a matter of days or a few short weeks. Or the original site can be reused.  

The number of people may have increased over the past few months but it is only because we, the audiogon community, keep going back to look to see if there are any changes or improvements. We truly loved Audiogon and want it to succeed.

Let me sum this up in a few short words...HEY AUDIOGON OWNERSHIP...YOU TRIED TO UPDATE THE SITE...IT IS A FAILURE...FIX IT, GO BACK TO ITS ORIGINAL FORM OR SELL THE SITE TO SOMEONE WHO CARES ABOUT THOSE WHO USE IT!!!

Stereophile and other audio publications have been silent about this subjuect.  Since Audiogon has changed the landscape of high end since its inception (I have bought items from various writers myself...mostly music) why not interview th owners of audiogon to get their reasoning behind such a fiasco?

quadlover
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last time to vent

It has been 3 months since I first posted this question here and on The Absolute Sound's site.  So far the comments are overwhelmingly against the new site.  There have been SOME changes but they are few and far between.  They have hardly attempted to fix the core problem...the new site is just a mess.  

To change, update or modify  a site isn't like designing an automobile where, if the new version isn't well received, it takes a year or 2 to correct or update.  A site can be changed in a matter of days or a few short weeks. Or the original site can be reused.  

The number of people may have increased over the past few months but it is only because we, the audiogon community, keep going back to look to see if there are any changes or improvements. We truly loved Audiogon and want it to succeed.

Let me sum this up in a few short words...HEY AUDIOGON OWNERSHIP...YOU TRIED TO UPDATE THE SITE...IT IS A FAILURE...FIX IT, GO BACK TO ITS ORIGINAL FORM OR SELL THE SITE TO SOMEONE WHO CARES ABOUT THOSE WHO USE IT!!!

Stereophile and other audio publications have been silent about this subjuect.  Since Audiogon has changed the landscape of high end since its inception (I have bought items from various writers myself...mostly music) why not interview th owners of audiogon to get their reasoning behind such a fiasco?

Dr. Spivey
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You may not realize it...

but this site was changed a while back and it was screwed up for months too.

Meanwhile people are buying and selling on AudiogoN everyday. It seems they have moved on, without you and the other Luddites. The forum still has the dreary, antiquated format you love so much, go over there and bitch and whine.

Why should Stereophile or any other publication be concerned with A'gon's affairs? Is the fact that they changed things and had problems newsworthy? Gee, that never happened on the internet before. Why don't you start your own site, or bettet yet, STFU.

islandsound
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Something new

 

I have been posting quite a few times on various forums and chats about Audiogon and about how there needs to be something new.  I am a unix/linux admin by trade.  I already have a small team that is willing to work on a new platform, current colleagues of mine I have approached with the idea and they want to work on it.  I also run a radio station in LA and have the ability to get a following for it with some advertising with integration.  I also had an idea about finding someone interested in LA to have a talk show about audiophile gear and also about broadcasting equipment.  It would be very easy for me to have production of a live broadcasted later podcasted show with live listeners and callers for questions and answers.  I have a lot of the pieces of the puzzle there but I need some glue and more people wanting to be involved with the project.  I am currently seeking investors and non investors to take this on.  I am also backing the project financially and with my other means of outlets of media to make it something.  I want to find people who have a passion for this.  There needs to be change and we need it now rather than later.  There are countless forums, chats and discussions out there about how Audiogon sucks, so lets change it together and start something.  Please contact me if you have any interest.

mrlipton
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audiogon

I agree completely.  Just try to post a wanted ad.  The site is a disaster!

Have you ever had anyone from management respond to you?

Only the idiots who "redid" the site.

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