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JIMV
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Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Senator Hatch, in his questioning of Sotomayer on her decision after Heller on incorporation of the fundamental right to arms against the states under the 14th Amendment, raised a very serious point that he did not explain very well (IMHO).

Judge Sotomayer decided that the 2nd amendment did not apply to the states under the doctrine of the 14th Amendment allowing the states to regulate the right to non existence if they had a logical case to do so.

Hatch tried to note, not very clearly, that there is a body of law and legal thinking that has developed over the last 110 or so years concerning incorporating a right against the states as a result of the 14th Amendment. Sotomayer, in her decision, did not use this body of law, as its use would have required her to find for inclusion of the right, but instead, went back far further to a period when the precedent did not reference the 14th and used other law in discussing the Bill of Rights to NOT incorporate any of those rights against the states. Using this precedence, she was able to rule against inclusion.

Think about that, if she wanted to come to one conclusion, she uses one batch of case law. If she wants another decision, she uses an older and largely changed bit of precedence ignoring case law from the last century.

She had a conclusion in mind and used law no longer relevant to make it.

That IS Judicial Activism.

Using this criteria, she could make a case that no rights protected in the Bill of Rights applies to the states as she used Presser to make her point

linden518
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

*yawn*

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

She is going to get confirmed. Personally, I don't like the way she looks. Never trust a woman with "man hands".

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
She is going to get confirmed. Personally, I don't like the way she looks. Never trust a woman with "man hands".

Hey, that's from cutting sugar cane and milking goats and slapping her kids upside the head. She's Puerto Rican.

(I'm Puerto Rican, so I know.)

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:

Quote:
She is going to get confirmed. Personally, I don't like the way she looks. Never trust a woman with "man hands".

Hey, that's from cutting sugar cane and milking goats and slapping her kids upside the head. She's Puerto Rican.

(I'm Puerto Rican, so I know.)


LOL, that's the most politically incorrect thing I've ever seen SM say!

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

One thing that has always amazed me about the 'litmus' questions is how bold all the nominees are in their lies.

"No, Senator, as a 54 year old attorney, then judge, and now Supreme Court nominee, I have never had a personal or professional conversation about abortion. Why, for all I know, I may be for it! No telling though, because I have never discussed the issue. It's just a coincidence that us conservative nominees all claim to have never, even once, pondered such a trivial societal issue."

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

So you believe a judge who predetermines a case before it is presented is a "yawn"...that is the issue. This judge wandered from the precedent she claims to respect to a period before the legal effect of the 14th Amendment was known, and selected precedent from that period....She cited Presser but her argument rested on Cruikshank...Have you ever read that one? It is the case where the court said that the federal government had no role in preventing the KKK from disarming blacks, stopping them from assembling, and then preventing them voting. The court decided that was a state role, if the state decided to actually interfere. This is despite the 13th Amendment, the Freeman acts, the Civil Rights act of 1866 and the 14th Amendment.

If the fine Judge could go all the way back to cherry pick precedent from reconstruction to justify cutting 2nd Amendment rights, then the same Judge could ignore precedent to add or remove any right she desires. Worse, she could decide that foreign law might be nice if she liked the result.

Very bad law and not a very good candidate for the court...That said, she is a liberal democrat being considered by a Senate controlled by liberal democrats. We could have video of her sharing BBQ sauce recommendations as to which goes best with braised Baby and she would still get approved. That is a political reality.

Her activism is a legal reality.

As I type, Graham is grilling her on war and POW's...she is clueless.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

She'll get confirmed unless she starts putting pubic hair in the Senator's drinks...

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Democrats are better than Republicans with their confirmations. Look at Bush I. Talk about taking one right in the balls.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


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So you believe a judge who predetermines a case before it is presented is a "yawn"...that is the issue.


No, you are wrong in your presumptions as usual. You are SO talented at attributing your feeble words/thoughts to other people, JIMV, how do you do that? Who taught you how to be so self-serving as to use other people's words for your purpose only?

What deserves a "yawn" is a grown-up man who could probably better occupy his afternoon yet is instead obsessed enough to pore over the TV, google court case numbers, etc.

What deserves a "yawn" is you're usually not much of an independent thinker when it comes to these things. 10 out of 10 people who visit this forum with any regularity can tell what you'll say about any given matter, politics and audio alike.

That spells b-o-r-i-n-g.

Hence the yawn.

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

He was boring until you got a chance to take his personal inventory.

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Of course we need subtitles....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qy6wo2wpT2k

Why couldn't Obama have nominated someone that looks like Anita?

JIMV
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:

Quote:
So you believe a judge who predetermines a case before it is presented is a "yawn"...that is the issue.


No, you are wrong in your presumptions as usual. You are SO talented at attributing your feeble words/thoughts to other people, JIMV, how do you do that? Who taught you how to be so self-serving as to use other people's words for your purpose only?

What deserves a "yawn" is a grown-up man who could probably better occupy his afternoon yet is instead obsessed enough to pore over the TV, google court case numbers, etc.

What deserves a "yawn" is you're usually not much of an independent thinker when it comes to these things. 10 out of 10 people who visit this forum with any regularity can tell what you'll say about any given matter, politics and audio alike.

That spells b-o-r-i-n-g.

Hence the yawn.

Let me guess...In your world 'Yawn' indicates deep interest in the process in which the folk who really run our lives, our Robed Masters' are selected....Interesting.

If one is bored by the important but entranced by the trivial (as in caring more about our hobby than our lives or country), it says more about the fellow yawning than it does about the one paying attention.

Just for into, googling court cases requires a small knowledge of what the case is about...Yawning guarantees continued ignorance.

My positions might be obvious and predictable, but they, unlike yours, are based on more than simple emotion.

linden518
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

You also have the gift of self-righteousness. Congratulations.

I did watch a part of the Sotomayor hearing at our law firm, too, so I do care. As for me not having small knowledge about these legal proceedings, again, you can attribute that to your vivid imagination... or to your googling prowess as you admit .

The point is, I do care about the hearings/confirmations. But not to a degree that I feel compelled to air some tawdry, commonplace thoughts, as you freely do.

Enjoy, JIMV! Try to have some original thoughts once in a while, though.

KBK
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

one of my favorite cartoons of all time..is where they have the caption:

"robots are for completing meaningless repetitive tasks, so you don't have to."

And the image is one of a robot with a remote control siting in a comfy chair, and a remote..watching television.

In another comfy chair, pointed in the opposite direction and behind the Robot's chair-away from the television, is a man absorbed in reading a book.

JIMV
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
You also have the gift of self-righteousness. Congratulations.

I did watch a part of the Sotomayor hearing at our law firm, too, so I do care. As for me not having small knowledge about these legal proceedings, again, you can attribute that to your vivid imagination... or to your googling prowess as you admit .

The point is, I do care about the hearings/confirmations. But not to a degree that I feel compelled to air some tawdry, commonplace thoughts, as you freely do.

Enjoy, JIMV! Try to have some original thoughts once in a while, though.

My thoughts are as tawdry as the candidate is substandard.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


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My thoughts are as tawdry as the candidate is substandard.


Hahaha, YOU said it, not me. Didn't know you were such a master of analogies, it's perfect! Agreed, both on the nature of your thoughts & candidate!

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:

Quote:
My thoughts are as tawdry as the candidate is substandard.


Hahaha, YOU said it, not me. Didn't know you were such a master of analogies, it's perfect! Agreed, both on the nature of your thoughts & candidate!

You might consider absolute ignorance of the issue a virtue, but I have more interest.

linden518
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Mr. Tawdry Thought (as you deem yourself), don't make me laugh. Whereas you get to go crazy on the google and get your expert opinion from pundit radio shows, I actually get to discuss the issues at work. What you have is not 'interest' but obsession driven by zealotry and herd mentality.

Like I said, boring.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

I have known too many lawyers to be impressed. You have a host of folk to do the grunt work and research while the lawyers often do little more than read what they are fed, not unlike Obama and his teleprompter brain. You may speak about the law every day but if it bores you to sleep, you have lost your ability to really understand it. Besides, the law is a discipline of varied expertise. I could easily be wrong, but I would bet you have never argued a Constitutional law case in federal court. Just because a lawyer knows divorce law or banking law does not make him an expert on the universe of case law governing any other topic.

I think it might be time for you to return to your nap, safe in the knowledge your elected leaders are looking out for your interests.

I'll watch Sotomayer bumble trough the process and emerge with a better understanding of where the Justice will be on issues than any gaggle of lawyers ignoring the event.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


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You may speak about the law every day but if it bores you to sleep, you have lost your ability to really understand it.


Again, clear messages refuse to enter through your thick skull. How many times in this thread has it been clarified that it's not the law that I'm bored by, but YOU!

And will you stop being pretentious & self-righteous just for a brief minute? You think you're the only one who cares about this country? And who the HELL made YOU some authority on constitutional law?!?

JIMV, this thread stands as is. Anyone can read this thread and see through, and I'll let your own words speak for themselves. Just don't try to edit or re-touch, okay, yappie?

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

YOUR being bored with me is a badge of honor for me...I respect your knowledge of audio but your knowledge of politics is right up there with my neighbors cat. Just because you know little to nothing of the issue does not make me wrong.

Put in legal terms...if you want to win a case, present an argument and enter your evidence into the discussion. Attacking the opposing counsel is a poor tactic for winning a legal, or political argument.

You might be bored but I am right on the issue. The good Judge DID cite the wrong set of precedence in her decision to produce a political result, exactly as Hatch noted.

linden518
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Hahaha... barf. You just love living with your blinders on, huh? You are saying I'm wrong even without knowing my stance on Sotomayor? What makes you presume I'm FOR affirming her?

You are so busy talking out of your ass that you don't even know my stance on the issue.

Another reason why people usually tune your ass out, yappie.

KBK
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Sotomayer? An NHL player is being considered for the US supreme court? Oh. I guess I heard it wrong. Oh well. The NHL player would probably be a better choice -than any or all of them. Too bad.

Just like I heard the other day that Pol Pot was putting out an album! I was a bit confused, I thought he was dead. I had visions of him doing the Vegas circuit. The Butcher of Cambodia is doing the Roger Whittaker thing? Duets with Celine Dion? (cue the 'Officer and a Gentleman' theme)

"No, you ass", I was told, "It's PAUL POTTS!"

"Oh," I says, "silly me."

"What's a 'Paul Potts?'"

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Paul Potts are very high end volume controls.

JIMV
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
Hahaha... barf. You just love living with your blinders on, huh? You are saying I'm wrong even without knowing my stance on Sotomayor? What makes you presume I'm FOR affirming her?

You are so busy talking out of your ass that you don't even know my stance on the issue.

Another reason why people usually tune your ass out, yappie.

Unless all your comments were off topic and simply attacks on me, from your first, I assumed you were in some minor way, responding to the topic...

The folk who tune me out are the same folk who voted for Obama, figure printing money is the fix for a bad economy, thought attacking the war when we were in it was in some bizarre way, patriotic, and in general come from a mind set to alien for me to worry about.

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

I find it appalling and shocking that two people would go after each other throats on this forum.

JIMV may listen at too much talk radio but selfdivider is an attorney. I think the two become a wash.

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Quote:
but selfdivider is an attorney

Or at least plays one on TV

linden518
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Quote:
I find it appalling and shocking that two people would go after each other throats on this forum.


Really? I would've never thunk it, coming from you, dude.

btw, I'm not an attorney yet (am entering law school next year) nor do I play one on TV. But I do enjoy wiping my ass with JIMV's half-baked ideas.

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Quote:

Quote:
Hahaha... barf. You just love living with your blinders on, huh? You are saying I'm wrong even without knowing my stance on Sotomayor? What makes you presume I'm FOR affirming her?

You are so busy talking out of your ass that you don't even know my stance on the issue.

Another reason why people usually tune your ass out, yappie.

Unless all your comments were off topic and simply attacks on me, from your first, I assumed you were in some minor way, responding to the topic...

The folk who tune me out are the same folk who voted for Obama, figure printing money is the fix for a bad economy, thought attacking the war when we were in it was in some bizarre way, patriotic, and in general come from a mind set to alien for me to worry about.


You hear that? It's the sound of your false assumptions breaking over your head. You were wrong to assume that in the first place... I said over & over that I was just bored by your usual, commonplace rants.

So far, you've admitted yourself that your thoughts are indeed tawdry. And that you made false assumptions about my stance on Sotomayor hearings.

Just keep diggin' that hole for yourself, man.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Yet I have ideas...you simply parrot. Ask those lawyers about Senators Hatch's point.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

Probably they have trouble looking up because the tinfoil hats keep falling off. :P

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Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

Don't know. I'm still stockpiling bullets, replacing fun guns with serious ones, stocking food and first aid gear, and just bought "The Coming Insurrection", though it hasn't arrived yet...

In 2007 I saw and wrote about the economic mess. (to a lot of giggling by the left who advised everyone knew the issue in 2008 would be the war, and anger from the right, who asked 'what problem with housing')Today I see and write about the coming meltdown in TAO's love and the rising anger as the left tries to change us into Cuba Norte...while apologizing around the world for our greatness.

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

That's not even funny, Buddha. I went to buy freakin' .22 ammo the other day and I had to buy a 1,000 round box. Same thing happened to me on the 9mm ammo. People are hoarding ammo like flies on shit.

BTW, the great rush for assault rifles must be over. I was in the gun store the other day and the guy had ARs on the wall. I was like, "Why aren't those sold yet?" He stated everybody has all the weapons they want now. I bought 1 box of 50 rounds of .22lr for nearly $4 for his troubles. He wouldn't sell me 2 boxes. 1 box per customer. So, now I have 1,050 rounds of .22lr

I'm not stockpiling medical stuff, food, or water though. The U.N. will provide that.

KBK
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Yes. The tension is palpable, isn't it?

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Quote:

Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

Don't know. I'm still stockpiling bullets, replacing fun guns with serious ones, stocking food and first aid gear, and just bought "The Coming Insurrection", though it hasn't arrived yet...

In 2007 I saw and wrote about the economic mess. (to a lot of giggling by the left who advised everyone knew the issue in 2008 would be the war, and anger from the right, who asked 'what problem with housing')Today I see and write about the coming meltdown in TAO's love and the rising anger as the left tries to change us into Cuba Norte...while apologizing around the world for our greatness.

Yeah, that's all well and good, but what are your perimeter defenses?

Heck, doesn't matter, anyway - you're online...they know all they need.

If you really wanna survive, ya gotta go off the grid. Living off the grid, man.

On the predictive side, I was telling people back in 2000 if Shrub won, we were in big trouble. You KNOW I got that right.

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

I like Oddball's mentality...

We see our role as essentially defensive in nature. While Rush's Dummies are advancing so fast and everyone's knocking themselves out to be heroes, we are holding ourselves in reserve in case Air America mounts a counteroffensive, which threatens Paris... or maybe even New York. Then we can move in and stop them. If we feel it will benefit us.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

Jon Stewart on Graham vs Sotomayor. Heh heh heh.

Lamont Sanford
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Quote:

Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

That's not even funny, Buddha. I went to buy freakin' .22 ammo the other day and I had to buy a 1,000 round box. Same thing happened to me on the 9mm ammo. People are hoarding ammo like flies on shit.

I can't say how much this saddens me. Who is that ammunition going to be used on? Neighbors? People from the next town? People who attend a different church? Immigrants like me? People who vote differently? The police, like those killed by that paranoid gun nut in Pennsylvania?

And don't tell me about Ruby Ridge or Waco. The aw of the land applies to all of us.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

dude, you are as white as my ass.


Quote:

Quote:
She is going to get confirmed. Personally, I don't like the way she looks. Never trust a woman with "man hands".

Hey, that's from cutting sugar cane and milking goats and slapping her kids upside the head. She's Puerto Rican.

(I'm Puerto Rican, so I know.)

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

John, its going to sit in their garages and storage spaces until it gets so old one would be afraid to use it. It is going take me a year to use my 1,050 rounds of .22lr for competition and practice at the range. Range shooters go through a lot of ammo. Hunters go through less. People who own weapons for home defense go through virtually no ammo. NRA members discourage hoarding ammo. Hoarding ammo is just people for the most part making a statement. Its a waste of money for these idiots and big profit for the manufacturers

People that will inevitably do what you describe may or may not hoard ammo. Just depends on the crazy fucker. Seems to me you're stereotyping people in general on this issue. It's the idiots that go to Walmart and so forth that buy up four or five regular boxes of 20 or 50 rounds left in stock that is adding up. I run out of ammo and the smallest box is 1,000 rounds than that is what I will purchase. It's not going to sit around until it expires. I'm going to use it.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

this is not for you, CM.... mistake using the quote function

I just shot two dogs today. woke up this morning and saw a Labrador and a Weimaraner playing with one of our chickens.. they had the feathers plucked off, and were just tossing it about as if it were some toy....... that drove me to rage,(the chicken they had was the one my daughter took to liking and called it "her chick")...so, fighting the urge to get a baseball bat and bludgeon them to death, I went inside, grabbed my Mossberg 410 ("home defense" series) , loaded it up, and promptly sent them home to doggie Jesus(or doggie Satan or doggie buddha , insert favorite deity)

I was tempted to take the dog corpses and dump them on the owners front door step(it is the owners fault, after all)...but I thought better of it and just buried them right beside the chicken.

if the dumb assed owners had kept their dogs tied up...theyd still have the dogs, and i'd still have my chicken(our poultry is a source of revenue as we take the eggs to market every saturday morning...(it isnt much but it all goes to our childrens college fund)

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

I didn't shoot my neighbor's dog. But I did call animal control on their ass because they won't keep their dog tied up in the front yard. Fucking little miniature doberman looking thing.

Once a dog kills a chicken it can never go back to not killing chickens. That's a fact that everybody knows about in the country. In case you city folk get shocked by what ncdrawl did. It's proof of Darwin's Theory of Evolution.

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Quote:
Yes. The tension is palpable, isn't it?

Perhaps not in leftie cities where folk can surround themselves with other folk who are happy, but go out into flyover country...folk are mad and getting madder.

Here is a video of one of the RINO's who voted for the Cap and Tax bill without bothering to even read it and after getting 3-1 demands he reject it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pyne-KXD6fU

Now tell me folk are not getting riled. Remember, these are supposed to be his BASE...people outside of the cities and folk with their hands out for goodies ARE a tad tense.

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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:

Quote:

Quote:
Bottom line is that y'all should keep stockpiling bullets!

Hey, how's the black helicopter watch going up there?

That's not even funny, Buddha. I went to buy freakin' .22 ammo the other day and I had to buy a 1,000 round box. Same thing happened to me on the 9mm ammo. People are hoarding ammo like flies on shit.

I can't say how much this saddens me. Who is that ammunition going to be used on? Neighbors? People from the next town? People who attend a different church? Immigrants like me? People who vote differently? The police, like those killed by that paranoid gun nut in Pennsylvania?

And don't tell me about Ruby Ridge or Waco. The aw of the land applies to all of us.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

You obviously missed the news coverage of Katrina...weeks of absolute chaos EXCEPT in the suburbs around New Orleans that defended themselves from the trash gone a looting.

Most of the folk I know in flyover country have thousands of rounds as a matter of course.

The folk who are bought with the idea of a free lunch paid for by others will be the ones unprepared for the result of their political actions. Flyover country will not roll over and be looted without a fight.

Buddha
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
this is not for you, CM.... mistake using the quote function

I just shot two dogs today. woke up this morning and saw a Labrador and a Weimaraner playing with one of our chickens.. they had the feathers plucked off, and were just tossing it about as if it were some toy....... that drove me to rage,(the chicken they had was the one my daughter took to liking and called it "her chick")...so, fighting the urge to get a baseball bat and bludgeon them to death, I went inside, grabbed my Mossberg 410 ("home defense" series) , loaded it up, and promptly sent them home to doggie Jesus(or doggie Satan or doggie buddha , insert favorite deity)

I was tempted to take the dog corpses and dump them on the owners front door step(it is the owners fault, after all)...but I thought better of it and just buried them right beside the chicken.

if the dumb assed owners had kept their dogs tied up...theyd still have the dogs, and i'd still have my chicken(our poultry is a source of revenue as we take the eggs to market every saturday morning...(it isnt much but it all goes to our childrens college fund)

Wow.

Did you come?

RGibran
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Joined: Oct 11 2005 - 5:50pm
Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law


Quote:
...grabbed my Mossberg 410 ("home defense" series)...

Lordy knows your family was under severe threat!

I've been anxious to try out my 20 guage model for real as well.

dribble dribble

RG

Lamont Sanford
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Re: Sotomayer wrong on guns AND the law

It's spelled, cum, not come. Haven't you ever read Penthouse or Harold Robbins?

What was the name of the dog that Atticus Finch shot in, "To Kill A Mockingbird"?

Atticus shot that dog because it had rabies. Dogs killing chickens in the country are treated no different than a fox in the chicken coup. And no different than a dog with rabies. You city folk better stay out of the country. You're liable to get yourselves hurt. Keep your dogs on a leash during potty breaks in Liberty County. Or rather as you're just passing through. And I suggest you do that.

It's funny but my diversified work place always want me to go with them when they have to perform audits in Backwater USA. They incorrectly assume my presence will somehow save them from having to squeal like a pig. In fact, I had to give a lecture once on looking behind office doors for rifles and so forth. There just there for hunting. People actually go hunting after work. Straight from the office. Tee hee....

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