gooddogbad
gooddogbad's picture
Offline
Last seen: Never ago
Joined: Apr 11 2007 - 6:28pm
PrePro + Amp or ???
JoeE SP9
JoeE SP9's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 6 hours ago
Joined: Oct 31 2005 - 6:02pm

For me building a good two channel music system was the main impetus. Adding MC/surround was an addition. I use my processor through my preamp running in bypass mode. All two channel sources are connected directly to my preamp and use my front channel amps and speakers.
For MC sources the bypass on my preamp allows my processor to drive my front channel amps and speakers. The rear speakers and amps are connected directly to my processor. I feel this gives me the best of both worlds.
In my experience receivers especially surround ones don't have top notch two channel reproduction. The preamp section is always lacking.

RGibran
RGibran's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 5 months ago
Joined: Oct 11 2005 - 5:50pm

Welcome to the forum!

JoeE describes a great way of integrating a high quality two channel system and multi channel surround system.

The same can be achieved with a surround sound receiver feeding a two channel integrated amplifier with a bypass input.

The two channel integrated is something that can always be added later if one feels the need to improve their two channel performance.

Therefore, based on your excellent question, I would think a current mid to top line surround sound receiver similar to what you have should provide all the features you require to keep you happy for another 10 years.

struts
struts's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 10 months ago
Joined: Feb 1 2007 - 12:02pm


Quote:
The same can be achieved with a surround sound receiver feeding a two channel integrated amplifier with a bypass input.

The two channel integrated is something that can always be added later if one feels the need to improve their two channel performance.


Quite a coincidence, that is exactly the conclusion I came to with a good friend only yesterday. He has a Pioneer somethingorother HT amp feeding a 7.1 system comprising B&W Nautilus 804 fronts with matching center and Mirage surrounds/rears complemented with a Velodyne sub.

He has been pleased with the AV performance but came to realize his stereo audio-only performance is well below par, even in 'Direct Pass-thru' mode. We both suspected it was the amp and not the speakers that was the weak link. It was my friend who proposed the idea of adding a better stereo amp for the fronts and connecting the L&R front pre-outs of his HT amp to the power-ins of an appropriate stereo integrated. His main 2-channel source (a Mac Mini driving an Apogee Duet FireWire DAC/headphone amp) would be plugged into a line level input on the 2-channel amp meaning he would only have to switch in one place and wouldn't have to disconnect/reconnect any cables to change between video and music.

Poking around on the internet I stumbled upon a pre-owned Plinius 8200 MkII at 1/3 of list (about $1000), amazingly it seems the ad had only been placed minutes earlier. These don't come up too often here and this looked like a pristine unit. Sorted! The 8200 has an AV processor loop making it perfect for this application, and my friend even found a review on the net indicating it might be a good timbral match for the 804s. To my great relief he snagged it and is picking it up tomorrow. I can't wait to hear the difference it makes. I'll report back on our findings.

RGibran
RGibran's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 5 months ago
Joined: Oct 11 2005 - 5:50pm

Gee Struts,

If things don't work out I might know someone willing to take that animal off your buddies hands. I hear thay take a whole damn day to warm up!

struts
struts's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 10 months ago
Joined: Feb 1 2007 - 12:02pm

Thanks RG. I told him that at $1000 he would never lose money on it. Now if only my own audio purchases were half as savvy!

struts
struts's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 10 months ago
Joined: Feb 1 2007 - 12:02pm

Well it's all hooked up and sounding great. We had a small problem with RFI which turned out to be coming from the Mac Mini. None of the wall sockets in my friend's listening room are grounded (hundred-year-old appartment with forty-year-old wiring) and the Mac had no less than four(!?) different connections to the HT amp so I suspect the noise was somehow being transmitted through the floating ground. Turned out that the USB connection was the culprit, however the introduction of the Duet had rendered it redundant so he just unplugged it.

Based on a brief listen (and bearing in mind the amp was cold) my first impresisons were of a big, bold and 'honest' sound. Lots of detail (but not 'hifi' hyperdetail) and good separation of individual instruments. Overall I found the tonal balance slightly 'dark' although I can't say whether this is down to the Plinius, the combination with the 804s, or room interactions. However the whole thing sounded very musical with a good sense of PRaT. I even got a sense that the Plinius might have been exposing the limits of the B&Ws, can't remember noticing hearing where the bass rolls off before.

Anyway, my friend is delighted and says that the sound has continued to improve as the unit has warmed up.

At first blush it would seem the Plinius was a great buy. Thanks JM!

gooddogbad
gooddogbad's picture
Offline
Last seen: Never ago
Joined: Apr 11 2007 - 6:28pm

Thanks for the suggestions. A couple more questions if I might...
So, though I want to upgrade sonically, the key impetus I have at the moment is to upgrade the feature set (add HDMI, new codecs,etc.) to the processing/switching side of things). I just don't have enough budget for a pre-pro and an amp at the same time. Is it possible to purchase a pre-pro and use the receiver as an amp for the time being? And if so, what are biggest pitfalls/challenges I'd face with that.

Thanks again!
dan

struts
struts's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 10 months ago
Joined: Feb 1 2007 - 12:02pm


Quote:
Is it possible to purchase a pre-pro and use the receiver as an amp for the time being? And if so, what are biggest pitfalls/challenges I'd face with that.


Yes, according to the manual for your receiver it does offer power-amp inputs for each of the five channels (see page 18 "Connecting an External Decoder") so you could use it purely as a power amp with a pre-pro.

Personally, I would still go the route described above (i.e. upgrade to a more modern HT integrated and then subsequently add a really good stereo integrated with an AV loop). Idea is to divert a substantial portion of the budget to the L&R fronts, if these are high quality I suspect very few people would be able to hear that you had economized on the sides/surrounds. I'd be really interested to hear Kal's opinions on that.

Log in or register to post comments
-->
  • X