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March 2, 2008 - 8:31am
#1
Now doesn't this OBSOLETE
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Welcome back DUP. I'm sure your return is stress that more than some can bear. I hope so.
Post something here:
http://forum.stereophile.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=35717&Main=34587#Post35717
Yeah, but DSD is dead. It's gonna be either Blue Ray or TCP/IP.
But DSD is the recording format, it can surely be put on teh Blu-Ray medium, just like DSD hybrid CD layer sounds so superiror to a CD only PCM CD of teh same material. DSD is right now the ultimate digital recording method. Just what is the blu-Ray format anyway, isn't it just a larger capacity optical disc cus' of the different wavelength laser, Blu-Ray audio can still be DSD format no? When Philips/Sony introduced DSD/SACD, I bet Blu-Ray was already in their labs, they developed it all anyway, with Blu-ray they got others on the wagon early on, so it would win any format war. Philips did it with CD back in teh late 70's early 80's which is why it succeded so quick, blu-Ray is the meduium, right not a format? No? DSD audio on blu-Ray I bet it's coming, DSD is future proof? Unlike pure perfect sound forever....DSD baby, since they also have DSD 2X, it's perfect for HD Blu-Ray, it's all coming together, a perfect plan forever. Philips/Sony have it all figured out. Sony also got smart and listened to Philips, no more Beta Max debacle
Only allowed to post here, as per the rules and regs of my parole. Anywhere else, the choke collar gets yanked!!!!
Are you allowed to rant and rave in all your former glory as long as it's here only?
That is the least "they" could do if your are being confined to "rants and raves"
I think you should post anywhere you like as long as you keep the rants here. Don't engage in controversy in other forum topics. You can always bring it back here.
Dup, I love my Korg, but I'd gladly pay another grand to upgrade the input and output stages and add a little shielding here and there. There's low level noise added due to the "consumer" level combo inputs and less than stellar output sections.
Still, the 130dB dynamic range is stunning and makes live recording a breeze. The noise floor is low compared to the potential signal, but I'm hoping that Ric Schultz will do some mods for me so that I can archive without that residual noise.
If Linn made the Korg, it'd be in a billet aluminium case and cost $20K, when all you need is a few hundred invested in some key parts and isolation to achieve true world class performance. It's almost there now, but not quite, IMHO.
Do you have one yet Dup? I think you'll love it. There's all kinds of fun to be had.
Dave
Blu-Ray already supports Dolby HD (MLP based lossless up to 24/192). Many Blu-Ray players already recognize it. For example, all Toshiba models do. There are around 30 Blu-Ray discs with Dolby Digital HD soundtracks.
Given this, I doubt we will see DSD on Blu-Ray, especially given the difficulties of dealing with DSD digital streams.
I haven't yet taken the time to compare 24/192 to DSD at 5.6MHz, but I will sometime in the next couple of months. I'm suspecting that it'll be very hard to tell them apart.
If so, then I'll archive at 24/192 and use DSD @5.6 only for live recording, to gain the dynamic range luxury, then down convert for playback. At least that's what I'm thinking right now.
Dave
I'm thinking of getting some AKG C3000B condensors for it, gonna try some live recording when my friend is wailing away with his band of greats www.mattoree.com I can make the bootleg series, like Bob Dylan tapes, only higher DSD quality I managed to find the Korg for $949, I think a good deal, everyone else had it for like $1200 or so...KORG, what a dumb name, sounds like some 1950's monster from Tokyo.
Yes, i would think so, since is called RANTS and RAVES...have I told you lately how great........is? And how **** is way over priced and probably a bunch of nonsense.?
It should be in i think by the end of this week from OR. They had teh best price no shipping either. Yeah, this thing looks to be made for it's purpose, without all the nonsense associated with BS "audiophile" nonsene. you are right the ckts could be packaged into some bizzare over done Audiophile way and get teh price up for no reason, this thing should be pretty neat. Like anything based in reality electronics, it should be better cheaper smaller, which is what KORG manged to do. I see $20,000 CD only players, and they use Philips VAM1202 optical assys/sled, I bought a few spares for my Philips units they where friggin less than $30 from MCM...the entire sled, optical laser etc, i had to change one in my 10 year old changer plays like new, teh old grease was causing the sled to not move as free as it shoulda' $20,000 CD players, come on already, usless, no amount of words can justify such nonsense in teh consumer world, hell, pro heavy duty units that take a daily beating in studios don't go anywhere near that price. this KORGS for you, seems like a great start for cheaper and cheaper DSD, too bad all CD's where not done in DSD Hybrids now.
What do you think of the supplied software with the MR1000? I have printed out teh manual and it looks well written, explains things nicely, hope they sell thousands of em, so then they make more better cheaper, with more features, and more shielding for ya
The supplied software with the Korg is an afterthought. It works, but it's slow. Elk says he's using DiscWelder to downconvert and it's also slow. They could care less about putting out a Vista update, etc., etc. BUT it works (even on Vista).
Apparently the really good software for downconverting and upconverting is pro-level and costs thousands.
Dave
24 bit gives you almost 150dB dynamic range. This should cover your headroom needs.
I've seen a number of articles where electronics engineers explain that PCM sampling rates over 96k not add additional fidelity - not because the higher rates are not theoretically better, but because the way the current crop of chips implement the higher sampling rates. I'll post links if I find these again.
(This doesn't apply to DSD as it is a one bit "up or down" sampling system - different issues).
I haven't found that I hear much/if any, difference going to 24/192. However, I like DSD better than PCM. I just wish I culkd do something with DSD - the only way to edit and distribute DSD is by converting it to PCM.
Can you discern a difference between regular DSD and 2xDSD?
Frankly I haven't tried. Hopefully I'll get a long weekend in the next month or two and play around with it.
It's interesting, my highest quality repeatable source is some of my old D2D recordings. Perhaps I could record myself on trumpet, but precisely repeating the dynamic is impossible. The D2D is only two steps removed from live in an all-analog domain and, of course, is repeatable.
Dave
I have compared formats by recording the analog outs of my SACD player and by recording an LP direct from the phono pre output.
However, the best I have found is to have a group (such as a quintet) play the same piece twice. While the volume won't be exactly the same, it will be pretty close. Plus, I find that I can discern differences more readily if I listen for longer periods before comparing.
I can't tell much difference when I record myself playing trumpet. I need something more complex, such as multiple instruments in a reverberant room.
Welcome back DUP!
Man, I missed you on the liquid cable thread!
Back on topic. This is a very tasty bit of gear. Wouldn't mind having a go with that myself.
Wow! I'm actually impressed. Maybe a certain editor will see the light when it comes to our government having to take certain measures to protect national interest. Let this be a lesson. And I'm also shocked that people are actually not attacking DUP for starting a thread. Yeah Team!
Give it time- he's starting to bang the same old drum like a Whack-A-Mole. (Which is music to some who enjoy those long, self-indulgent drum solos from the '60's)
Better the drum solo than your calls for censorship of posts that don't adhere to your limited world view.
Tom, What I really think we need is....more cow bell.
I think we should start a DUP appreciation thread.
Absolutely!! But could I please have...a little more cowbell?
What would be a good review is get one of them grossly overpriced CD only players, and test it against this really slick $949 shipped Korg MR-1000 in all it;'s numerous formats including 2X DSD wich is some kind of neat technology, which furthers proves how over priced these units that merely play CD and use 20 year old chips, with the bogus claim of they sound better. Yeah, riiight, if they where better why did Philips stop making them and move on. And Korg can do it for $949 selling price, you really gotta do some logical thinking and ask, why is a CD player selling for $27,000 !!!?? come on. And some use the VAM 1202 Philips drive/optical assys. The same one in my Philips changers/recorders that where $300 RETAIL!!! And I got a few and replaced one that was sticking, from Parts Express, they where......under $29 on sale!!! Now like $29 for the complete optics/drive assys. There is justifying a price tag of these units that sell for such ridiculous prices. No golden ears telling me about pace, rhythm, and other nonsense makes it true. And THD % that are a joke. I bet a under $1000 Korg in DSD smokes the $100K spinning platter, another good test lets do it John...lets start getting some really cool comparisons, not just advertising blather about how great this months high priced obsolete CD player, DAC for $50K is. Let's compare current 21st century technology to overpriced obsolete 21st century spining platters. And the MR-1000 is small well made aluminum case, with carry bag etc. The 2 AKG mics are bigger than the recorder/player
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBbv2v0xOlA
Listen carefully to the recording. During the drum solo (5:00) you can hear the editor whispering in the background...."Someday in this land a president will watch you have sex from the comfort of his room in The Garden of Eden with his hand...".
Eden? Is that code for the White House?