I was once, in the third world, bitten by a large, mean and wild dog, while trying to stop the thing from attacking the third secretary of the SA Embassy. I had to go through the entire series of rabies shots plus tetanus and another shot I forgot. The similarity in situations is this...when a nation behaves exactly like that wild dog and threatens attack on others for no reason whatever, and cannot be relied on to keep the threat and the act separate...ie, when a nation lashes out without reason or rational purpose, it must be controlled exactly like that rabid dog.

Put more succinctly, Korea, North and South are one people BUT the South is civilized and the North rabid. Stating an obvious fact is not racist nor mean spirited but simply facing reality. One cannot negotiate with or cuddle a rabid regime.

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Put more succinctly, Korea, North and South are one people BUT the South is civilized and the North rabid. Stating an obvious fact is not racist nor mean spirited but simply facing reality. One cannot negotiate with or cuddle a rabid regime.

I get your point, especially since you make clear now that we shouldn't "cuddle" a rabid regime (I like cuddle better than coddle ). But still I think you're treading a fine line when you generalize, that though Koreans are one people, the South Koreans are civilized and North Koreans are rabid. I'm willing to bet that the majority of North Korean citizens are too impoverished and starved to even scheme of being rabid war-mongerers.

It does not matter what the majority thinks or wants when a single person directs their actions completely...Just like Hitlers Germany, one mad despot rules.

I think you miss the point of my comment with your neat cliche, JIMV .

It sounded a lot like you were trying to excuse the North Korean people for the actions of their government. That is like excusing the German people for the actions of the Nazi government...The 'good German' argument or the old pretense that every Frenchman was in the resistance. While individual guilt is just that, individual, the people as a whole also have responsibility for their nations actions. Why else has TAO wandered all over the world apologizing for imagined American faults...When the government of the North changes and they nation as a whole reenters the civilized world, then this national guilt will begin to fade.

The obvious pitfalls of generalizing arguments like yours, JIMV, is that they almost always miss the subtle, but crucial points. Such as the important fact that Hitler's Third Reich was still VOTED into power by the people. Kim Jong Il's regime, umm, doesn't allow that... (it does send you to winter prison camps where you get executed for even uttering anything remotely judgmental vs. the state.) So the complicity of the people in creating such a state is vastly different.

Second of all, your arguments can't be logically correct. Ever hear of the Fallacy of Composition, in which one falsely argues that what is true of the part must be true of the whole? (Google it, if you must.) To say that the Germans are rabid dogs because the Third Reich are rabid dogs, or that the North Korean people are rabid dogs because the Kim Family regime is rabid dogs, uses just poor poor, sodden logic, the kind that has been refuted for centuries long, even by high school debate teams .

I know you aren't being racist, but such faulty logic inevitably lead to racism. When you paint a whole people or a nation or a race with your broad paintbrush smeared in shit-color, attributing the faults of the particular to the entire group, what do you think it results in?

That was a rhetorical question, btw.

Weinmar Germany was a parliamentary system. Hitler was not voted in. He ran for Chancellor but lost with 37% of the vote. As a result the party began open violence and emerged as the largest, but still minority party in 1932, though losing seats so Papin had Hindenburg APPOINT Hitler chancellor in 1933 of a coalition government and that was the last real election seen in Germany till after the war.

Basically, this is like the Democrats call to 'count all the votes'...they count real votes, imaginary votes and perhaps votes over and over, while not counting the others guys, until they win and then the counting stops.

As to the rest of your post, the North Koreans are what they are. If their government changes what the North Koreans are might change BUT that has yet to be seen. Till then, if The Dear Leader sneezes, 23,000,000 North Koreans say 'Gesundheit' in universal harmony.

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Weinmar Germany was a parliamentary system. Hitler was not voted in. He ran for Chancellor but lost with 37% of the vote. As a result the party began open violence and emerged as the largest, but still minority party in 1932, though losing seats so Papin had Hindenburg APPOINT Hitler chancellor in 1933 of a coalition government and that was the last real election seen in Germany till after the war.

Basically, this is like the Democrats call to 'count all the votes'...they count real votes, imaginary votes and perhaps votes over and over, while not counting the others guys, until they win and then the counting stops.

This again illustrates why you can't see the picture. Sure, after the '30 elections, you can say the Nazi party was the "minority" party, but they went from #9 among the parliamentary parties to #2. And you are flat out wrong (do your research, JIMV) because after '32, they were THE largest party with 230 electoral seats.

And please stop spinning' with that Democrat vote-count stuff b/c right now you just can't even get the facts correct. Besides: my point was that the Nazi Party was still an ELECTED body of parliamentary party. The Kim Jong Il Regime, HELL no. Stop spinning. Jesus, man... have some integrity.

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As to the rest of your post, the North Koreans are what they are. If their government changes what the North Koreans are might change BUT that has yet to be seen. Till then, if The Dear Leader sneezes, 23,000,000 North Koreans say 'Gesundheit' in universal harmony.

Again, nice to form a caricature of an entire populace based on the propaganda snippets created by the NK Communist Party that are shown on TV. You have no idea on what an 'average' NK person feels, how he/she lives. I'll link to some books in English, just in case you felt like exploring outside your world of cliches and stereotypes:

http://www.amazon.com/Aquariums-Pyongyang-Years-North-Korean/dp/B0027VSZZW/ref=pd_sim_b_4

http://www.amazon.com/This-Paradise-North-Korean-Childhood/dp/0349118655/ref=pd_sim_b_3

I'm sure the same North Koreans who risk their lives to defect to the South amidst hail of bullets, the same people who witness their sisters and brothers executed in routine public mass executions, if not starving to their deaths, are really saying "gesundheit" to their Dear Leader.

The most idiotic thing I've read in a while.

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And you are flat out wrong (do your research, JIMV) because after '32, they were THE largest party with 230 electoral seats.

Out of how many? They never were a majority party (as in held 51% of the seats), at least when elections where happening.

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Besides: my point was that the Nazi Party was still an ELECTED body of parliamentary party. The Kim Jong Il Regime, HELL no. Stop spinning. Jesus, man... have some integrity

Your 'point' makes no sense...That party, elected as it was, was backed by a hundred thousand armed thugs, the SA, an organization that existed to keep the elections from being too free and to create fear and uncertainty to encourage voters to vote for order and peace.

Pretending the Nazi party was freely elected and not the result of electoral violence and fear is simply not true...have some integrity yourself. Your point does not stand.

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Again, nice to form a caricature of an entire populace based on the propaganda snippets created by the NK Communist Party that are shown on TV. You have no idea on what an 'average' NK person feels, how he/she lives.

Which has nothing at all to do with the real point, which is that this rabid dog is 100% controlled by a small number of folk who make that diverse body of people that I, and you, know nothing about do exactly what that Dear Leader demands....

That is the only point that matters.

Dear Leader?

Are we talkin' 'bout Rush?

Rush says if he farts, he has 20 million blind followers ready to check his butt.

Blind followers are blind followers, I guess.

The Dear leader has parades, the blind Ditto-follower nutjobs here call theirs Tea Parties

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Dear Leader?

Are we talkin' 'bout Rush?

Rush says if he farts, he has 20 million blind followers ready to check his butt.

Blind followers are blind followers, I guess.

The Dear leader has parades, the blind Ditto-follower nutjobs here call theirs Tea Parties

Fortunately, Crush Bimbo and companions are only CALLING for civil war here. In North Korea, the lunatic fringe took over the country and holds most of it hostage to their cult of personality.

I'm surprised Crush Bimbo and Shotgun Dick Cheney don't actually LIKE the NK leadership.

Consider:

All consider dissent treason
All want a top-down, totalitarian government
All run cults of personality
All appeal to ignorance

Hunh. Funny they don't like each other.

Or at least that's the opinion of this Goldwater Republican.

I can clarify this. The North Koreans are rabid dogs. Three year of war and over 30+ thousand American KIA tells me even the average North Korean will cut your throat once the order is given. IMHO. The inglorious basterds go to North Korea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sQhTVz5IjQ

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I can clarify this. The North Koreans are rabid dogs. Three year of war and over 30+ thousand American KIA tells me even the average North Korean will cut your throat once the order is given.

So, how do you relate the actions of fanatical followers to the average starving NK housewife?

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The North Koreans are rabid dogs. Three year of war and over 30+ thousand American KIA tells me even the average North Korean will cut your throat once the order is given.

Sounds like any soldier in any given war, Lamont. What average soldier wouldn't cut your throat once the order is given (not to mention rapes & pillages committed even when the order is not given - this goes for Americans, Africans, Asians, Euros, all)? Your clarification only proves all are rabid sons of bitches.

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So, how do you relate the actions of fanatical followers to the average starving NK housewife?

Dead.

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Your clarification only proves all are rabid sons of bitches.

Correct. Only in my case I prefer basterd.

are you going to go see that quentin tarantino flick, 'inglourious basterds'?

Sadly, this guy may not be all that wrong..with recent studies in genes showing that the differences in people (Humans) that were thought to be minor (genetically) can be as high as 20% (multiples of gene sets). Oddly enough, that is the ~exact gene ratio~ as stated clearly --- by and on +12,000 year old Sumerian cuneiform tablets pulled out of the sands in Iraq.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-489653/Human-race-split-different-species.html

If one looks at it coldly, with no emotion..there is room for him to potentially be right.

I see it, right here - in this thread.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

....Adding to these incomprehensible orders restricting military options, was the amazing fact that Russian commanders were running the conflict on both sides. Under the agreement at Yalta and due to their supplying North Korea with military hardware and technology, Soviet Military officers were largely in control of the war. Author Epperson cited a Pentagon press release which identified two Soviet Officers as being in charge of movements across the 38th parallel. One, a General Vasilev, actually was overheard giving the order to attack on June 25th, 1951.

General Vasilev's chain of command reached from North Korea to Moscow to the UN Undersecretary General for Political and Security Council Affairs. At this same time, General McCarthur's chain of command went through President Truman to the UN Undersecretary General for Political and Security Council affairs, and office held at that time by Russian Constantine Zinchenko. This meant that Soviet Officers were overseeing the North Korean war strategy while reporting back to a fellow Soviet Officer in the same UN office that co-ordinated the Allied war effort.

In effect, the Communists were directing both sides of the war. Except the author failed to recognize that groups within the US had financed Communist Russia in the first place. Dean Acheson later admitted, 'The only reason I told the President to fight in Korea, was to validate (the existence of) NATO."

The whole idea was to maintain 'the power of war' over mankind. The same people made money and consolidated power on BOTH sides of the conflict.

The whole thing was a confidence game for consolidation of control over the greater mass of man....with mere human lives as a trivial cost.

Exactly like nearly every single war that has ever occurred. Basically the creation of 'teams'. Don't forget to cheer for ~YOUR~ guys. Remember-never stop playing/watching! You might have to think-instead. Now, wouldn't that just be awful?

Chimpanzees in the Deep Congo WILL and DO go attack the next group of chimps as a raiding party. The Males of one group gather and go attack. They don't do this often..but the do actually do it! They most times manage to kill one of the 'others', from the other clan. Usually one of the younger ones. Then they ~EAT~ that Chimp, raw --obviously.

Men, it seems, are no different.

Wake up. Somebody is fucking with you. For a very long time, now. War and the creation of differences...is a method of keeping man outside of prosperity, growth, and thought. The created differences or, opposing groups-- maintains control via conflict. Man is purposely held to his animal instincts.

People can do this- not just those who control nations. If you work in an office, I'm SURE you know of at least one person who does this exact thing in your office-every day.

You know that if you were a nasty bastard..that in your office ..you yourself could slip into this - very easily. It isn't difficult, it merely requires a true lack of morals, ethics or character. The exact same thing that the given asshole in your office uses to manipulate others.

What could possibly make you think that those who control nations ---don't do the same? How do you think that these people managed to get where they are?? By being nice? Fuck me-don't be stupid.

Like the person in your office who lies every day, right to your face... imagine politicians and corporate leaders standing up and telling you straight to your face about truth, liberty, freedom, terry-wrists, drugs, crime, evil and all that shit....

Think about it.

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Wake up. Somebody is fucking with you. For a very long time, now.

This is the type of moron that urinates all over himself by getting his head sawed off by some rabid dog because he has faith in the Humane Society. Wake up?

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are you going to go see that quentin tarantino flick, 'inglourious basterds'?

Does a bear shit in the woods?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KldfkE462Bk

...

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jEOzlO6E8GGPr3SCcUuDfmlQ9_JwD98E98J80

Actually, I'd rather be called a rabid dog than a Roland Burris. Not that this was surprising, but just seeing the allegations confirmed in actuality revolts me yet again. Don't send this guy to a Federal but to a State prison, so he can be pwned by his many "friends," the slimy bastard.

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http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jEOzlO6E8GGPr3SCcUuDfmlQ9_JwD98E98J80

Actually, I'd rather be called a rabid dog than a Roland Burris. Not that this was surprising, but just seeing the allegations confirmed in actuality revolts me yet again. Don't send this guy to a Federal but to a State prison, so he can be pwned by his many "friends," the slimy bastard.

Now, you're talking! Let the "brothers" have him in jail. He'd be somebody's bitch before sunrise the next day. You see? Even you have a little junkyard dog in ya!

The really disgusting part of this whole affair is the point that Blagojevich was only outed when he decided to stand by the side of people who were put out of work by the ecenomic downturn..and stood in solidarity with actual workers.

Within 24 hours of that moment...he was gone.

A little mini-JFK type warning to any other part of the machine that feels it might want to step out of line.

They guy was trying to make money by practically putting a Senate seat up for sale on Ebay. Christ, there is always something going on with you. I think you are delusional and in the care of some sort of mental health authority.

May 27 (Bloomberg) -- North Korea threatened a military response to South Korean participation in a U.S.-led program to seize weapons of mass destruction, and said it will no longer abide by the 1953 armistice that ended the Korean War.

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May 27 (Bloomberg) -- North Korea threatened a military response to South Korean participation in a U.S.-led program to seize weapons of mass destruction, and said it will no longer abide by the 1953 armistice that ended the Korean War.

As long as he keeps the workers and housemaids passports locked up in the safe, as usual, it will be fine.

Distract, distract, distract.

Create the conflict (problem), allow it to take place (reaction)...propose the solution.

This game is as old as the hills.

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May 27 (Bloomberg) -- North Korea threatened a military response to South Korean participation in a U.S.-led program to seize weapons of mass destruction, and said it will no longer abide by the 1953 armistice that ended the Korean War.

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Cheney/Bush coddled them way too much.

Now we're seeing what Bush has wrought.

Another mess for Obama to clean up.

Watch the timing of North Korea and Iran's tantrums - you know they Twitter each other and are, like, best friends on Facebook.

I hope Cheney's mansion in Dubai is OK.

Now that is amusing....the problem began under Clinton's inept rule, continued under Bush and continues to this day under TAO....Nothing has changed...appeasement, words and sucking up are the orders of the day...

Actually, the problem was instigated by that surrender monkey Eisenhower.

A little Boom Boom from Ike and we'd not be stuck with that loser country.

"The problem began under Clinton..."

LOL! You right wingers are absolutely blind to your own side's failings.

Let's see...

Ike: 8 years

Kennedy/Johnson: 8 years

Nixon/Ford: 8 years

Carter: 4 years

Reagan/Bush: 12 years

Clinton: 8 years

Bush: 8 years

Red party: 36 years in office.

Blue Party: 20 years

And you call this a Clinton issue?

Sandwiched between a dozen years of Reagan/Bush and 8 years of Shrub, you think of this as a Clinton problem.

Amazing.

Did Rush preach that for you?

McCarthur wanted to bomb the Chinese supply lines out of existence - in places outside of China.

He was thwarted by the offices of the presidency and the government of the US.

In absolute disgust with the 'gameplan' (see my above quote from a book), he appealed to the public. For this, he was fired and basically, wished dead.

The next guy brought in, was General Matthew B. Bridgeway. He did exactly as they wanted, which was to perpetuate the police action. Not end it. He subsequently become a member of the CFR.

Ike did not send the surrender monkey HalfBright to suck up, Clinton did

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Ike did not send the surrender money HalfBright to suck up, Clinton did

Yeah, Clinton.

Clinton took the reigns and turned a viable North Korea into the kind of mess it is today.

Do you have, like, Red Party Autism?

When there is a problem, you start rocking back and forth repeating, "Clinton, Clinton, Clinton," or "Carter, Carter, Carter?"

Dude, you've moved beyond Kool Aid, what sort of hypnotic does Newt have you on? Have you tried to lobotomize the left side of your brain to be as true to the right as possible?

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Ike did not send the surrender money HalfBright to suck up, Clinton did

All these things are games, ploys to capture the attention and understanding of the average dude on the street. In the same way I can walk up to you today, and point a finger at your shirt and then flip it up and catch your nose..the same way that someone tricked you when you were a kid. The public still falls for this crap.

It's just games for the masses. Real and actual loose cannons who endanger the machine aren't allowed to exist. This is the real reason why Blagojevich was pulled. Not that he was rotten-that was the part of him that was useful. when he started to do things outside of his area or directives (if you will) -he was punted in less than 24 hours. the final straw that broke it for him, was his endangerment of the game plan to destroy American jobs. He stood with the workers, allowed himself to be on TV doing so..and he could have started a large labour movement. That was the very alarming danger for those who run the US. Cows on the rampage, is their fear.

I figure that if he hadn't been taken down by the investigation he'd of had a heart attack or died in his pool or similar-- in that same day.

Setting up Kennedy took 6 months.

I have nothing to add other than I had some amazing times in YoungSan and Daegu. For an infantry guy, the training SUCKS(cold, desolate, bleak) but the down time---kick ass.

We should get along better, HM.....didnt realize you were Korean(though I assumed some Asiatic bloodline)

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McCarthur wanted to bomb the Chinese supply lines out of existence - in places outside of China.

He was thwarted by the offices of the presidency and the government of the US.

In absolute disgust with the 'gameplan' (see my above quote from a book), he appealed to the public. For this, he was fired and basically, wished dead.

The next guy brought in, was General Matthew B. Bridgeway. He did exactly as they wanted, which was to perpetuate the police action. Not end it. He subsequently become a member of the CFR.

Very good! Check out the big brain on KGB?

Actually, it was Jimmy Carter that brokered a deal with the North Koreans. We give them nuclear technology to provide electricity throughout the country and in return the North Koreans can make a nuclear bomb. Something like that because people like Jimmy believe that there is good in everybody.

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Sean Penn: Last year I went to Iraq. Before Team America showed up, it was a happy place. They had flowery meadows and rainbow skies, and rivers made of chocolate, where the children danced and laughed and played with gumdrop smiles.

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Charles Lindbergh: The three most important groups who have been pressing this country toward war are the British, the Jewish, and the Roosevelt Administration. Instead of agitating for war, Jews in this country should be opposing it in every way, for they will be the first to feel its consequences. Their greatest danger to this country lies in their large ownership and influence in our motion pictures, our press, our radio and our government.

This IS an audio forum..so I thought I'd add some gravitas to the discussion:

But seriously..from Greg Palast:

"How did a berserker like North Korea

First of all it was North Korea that invaded South Korea. The USA was not prepared (sound familiar) and we were nearly driven into the sea. North Korea is very aggressive. Has been ever since the cease-fire as well. Since then every single incident of South Korean and American service personnel being attacked were provoked by North Koreans. Buddha, you got your head so far up your ass on this one I don't know if you will ever see the light day on this topic. Anybody that wants Gitmo closed and doesn't want North Korea closed as well is a fucking chickenshit hypocrite. I have no problem with Democrats waging war. Since you are counting your administrations, more American people have been killed in combat under a Democrat president than any other. It would take WWIII under a Republican to even come close to the death and destruction Democrat presidents have rained down on this earth. The Spanish American War (and its aftermath), WWI, The Bannana Wars (and its aftermath) WWII, Korea, and Vietnam. Nearly two-thirds of American casualties in Vietnam were under the command of a Democrat president from the very beginning. I trust that a Democrat isn't lusting for blood as much as I trust Mohammad next door is going to convert to Christianity. Yeah, so I hope Obama attacks North Korea with extreme prejudice. That would make my day.

As for North Korea today. You're correct. "W" didn't do shit and get this and dig it. That fucking pussy Jimmy Carter went over there for Clinton and gave them the technology to blow Seoul and Tokyo off the face of the earth. Gave-it-fucking-to-them!

It's a game, folks, figure it out.

There are no sides, parties or teams. Same-same. There is merely the appearance of 'sides'. These groups.. they made it up, they made up the public (media) face of it - just for people like you.

OK?

North Korea could be specifically planned (my personal bet), or it could be a bit like Kennedy, on the Saudi's part.

Kennedy played along with the game until he broke with them. He tried to create real money outside of the Federal reserve bank control system- the kind of money that Lincoln and McKinley both attempted to create. Money that was not created in debt to private banks and was controlled by the government. Tip of the iceberg, my friend.

In the same way that a man will never know his daughter's behavior in her dating life, you will never know the depth of the layers of lies and games in politics and business.

As you are a man on the street, it is far, far cheaper, far easier- to create a system of lies within which the powerful can play manipulation games - than it is to go to war with you by allowing you, the general public, to really know what is going on.

An entire library of books could be written on what the public, the cows..do not know about politics and power (in this day and age-rich/elite/business/etc). (Actually, that library has been written. You just have to start searching it out--and reading. That's all there is to it.)

Each day, each year, it gets deeper and more sophisticated and this game started before the first fiat currency was created..and that was well over 6,000 years ago.

Yes it really is that bad and it really is well beyond the ability of most to comprehend. This is how it hides itself, in plain sight-as it is just too big for the average man to mentally grapple with in one shot. Therefore, the common man...-they cannot see it.

Winston Churchill:
"From the days of Spartacus, Weishophf, Karl Marx, Trotski, Belacoon, Rosa Luxenburg, and Ema Goldman, this world conspiracy has been steadily growing. This conspiracy played a definite recognizable role in the tragedy of the French revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the 19th Century. And now at last this band of extraordinary personalities from the underworld of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their head and have become the undisputed masters of that enormous empire."

Benjamin Disraeli:
For you see, the world is governed by very different personages from what is imagined by those who are not behind the scenes.

Albert Einstein:
The ruling class has the schools and press under its thumb. This enables it to sway the emotions of the masses.

J. Edgar Hoover:
The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists.

Mayer Amschel Rothschild:
Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws.

Council on Foreign Relations:
The sovereignty fetish is still so strong in the public mind, that there would appear to be little chance of winning popular assent to American membership in anything approaching a super-state organization. Much will depend on the kind of approach which is used in further popular education.

The list goes on and on for thousands upon thousands of quotes.

Basically, folks, get over yourself and think clearly.

There are no sides-there never have been. There is merely a need by those who play at that level to create the lie in your mind to keep you from revolting. That's their real worry.

The system has been in place and developing for so long that it's complexity and depth is breathtaking, in these modern days.

In essence, don't worry about Korea, worry about the people who created this stage or part of the 'game' for you - worry about what their next step is.

It is very likely that you and others will stubbornly cling to your internal knowledge package as it is just too difficult, too mind wrenching to think of something that big; something that all encompassing that is making a total freaking mess of this planet, for desires and needs that you very likely will ~never~ understand. It is more likely that folks of that mental design and nature will throw rocks at me instead. That is a very sad thing.

Conspiracy forums are of no use either, they are merely a way of capturing the attention of the masses who might have found and are attempting to describe the toe of the elephant that they can 'sort of' envision. More games. As long as those conspiracy folks sit there, like the crew in Monty Python's 'Life of Brian' (comedy film) and continually talk and have 'meetings' (about defeating the horrible enemy), they will be wholly ineffective. If this is all they can do - they will forever be ineffective. However, those forums are a good way to keep tabs on that small percentage of the population that opens their eyes, just a crack. And on..and on, it goes. You don't get it - you and this planet are their playground. Maybe some day, you might mentally 'come to' and look around..and see the sides of the truck..and find you are a cow, in truck..born in captivity, traveling down a road and countryside of someone else's design going to..a slaughterhouse at a time and design of someone else's personal whim and design. Before that truck, you were in a field..with grass and sunshine - as far as the cow eye could see.

Then, one day.... things changed.

As even all of that...is just the tip of the Iceberg. For you are a 'organically 3-d referenced' organized semi-self directed structure, referenced primarily in this dimension, on a 3-d referenced backwater 'planet'/space/dimensional reference, in this 'frame of reference'.

But..one step at at time. First things first, which is to get the modified monkey to pull it's head out of it's ass.

On that note, I am done with this thread; I've done about as much as one can.

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First of all it was North Korea that invaded South Korea. The USA was not prepared (sound familiar) and we were nearly driven into the sea. North Korea is very aggressive. Has been ever since the cease-fire as well. Since then every single incident of South Korean and American service personnel being attacked were provoked by North Koreans. Buddha, you got your head so far up your ass on this one I don't know if you will ever see the light day on this topic. Anybody that wants Gitmo closed and doesn't want North Korea closed as well is a fucking chickenshit hypocrite. I have no problem with Democrats waging war. Since you are counting your administrations, more American people have been killed in combat under a Democrat president than any other. It would take WWIII under a Republican to even come close to the death and destruction Democrat presidents have rained down on this earth. The Spanish American War (and its aftermath), WWI, The Bannana Wars (and its aftermath) WWII, Korea, and Vietnam. Nearly two-thirds of American casualties in Vietnam were under the command of a Democrat president from the very beginning. I trust that a Democrat isn't lusting for blood as much as I trust Mohammad next door is going to convert to Christianity. Yeah, so I hope Obama attacks North Korea with extreme prejudice. That would make my day.

As for North Korea today. You're correct. "W" didn't do shit and get this and dig it. That fucking pussy Jimmy Carter went over there for Clinton and gave them the technology to blow Seoul and Tokyo off the face of the earth. Gave-it-fucking-to-them!

Wow, so much gibberish. Where to start?

How about starting with...if your Fox News Channel didn't work you up about fake North Korean atomic bomb tests (lots of TNT and no nukes is my bet) and their science fair rocket projects, how would anyone even know to care?

North Korea knows they would cease to exist if they acted up to too great a degree, they just have tantrums to try and get attention and cash.

North Korea is about as economically and culturally significant on the grand scheme as Lesotho, probably less.

The wests's greatest fear of North Korea is that the regime will fail and we'll be on the hook for trying to help with an outflow of poor starving people and a country with no idea of what it means to put in an honest work week.

My point to JIMV was that it takes more than a blue party administration from 1992-2000 to have allowed this mess to persist. He is so red-blinded, he likely runs around town talking about how Clinton appointed that liberal Judge Souter, too.

If you get worked up about North Korea...why?

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How about starting with...if your Fox News Channel didn't work you up about fake North Korean atomic bomb tests (lots of TNT and no nukes is my bet) and their science fair rocket projects, how would anyone even know to care?

I have to point out that the difference in explosion envelope makes an HE explosion rather different than a nuke.

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How about starting with...if your Fox News Channel didn't work you up about fake North Korean atomic bomb tests (lots of TNT and no nukes is my bet) and their science fair rocket projects, how would anyone even know to care?

I have to point out that the difference in explosion envelope makes an HE explosion rather different than a nuke.

Ah, yes, Cliff...err...JJ.

I'm sure when you ran the science division at Los Alamos you picked that up.

Even though you have analysed the data with your usual level of expertise, look it up. There is some controversy about real or not real.

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Even though you have analysed the data with your usual level of expertise, look it up. There is some controversy about real or not real.

Um, please show me where I said I'd analyzed the data. And, yes, I am actually aware of some controversy. I can also go to the USGS and look at the actual traces from seismographs. As can you. Did you?

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I have to point out that the difference in explosion envelope makes an HE explosion rather different than a nuke.

Unless you were making a random comment, your post implied that you had considered that the test may not have been a true nuclear blast and wished to disagree with my cynicism about the blast by pointing out the differing explosion envelopes - which would mean that you had compared the two possibilities.

Hence, my going along with your usual claims of gandiosity and analytic skill.

(I do thank you for bypassing your "I've been away doing real work" type of thread crap preamble, however!)

Would you post something like "I have to point out that the difference in explosion envelope makes an HE explosion rather different than a nuke" for no good reason?

Pure spitting of factoids, or did you have an opinion?

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Would you post something like "I have to point out that the difference in explosion envelope makes an HE explosion rather different than a nuke" for no good reason?

To point out, frankly, that one CAN generally determine the truth. The magnitude of this sucker was also quite big.

Thank god I didn't serve in the military with some of you guys. I would have shot you in the balls myself and then asked, "Does that feel real to you, skullfuck?"

BTW, I don't watch much cable news. I listen to NPR during the day.

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Thank god I didn't serve in the military with some of you guys. I would have shot you myself and then asked, "Does that feel real to you?"

It's the difference between actually brandishing a weapon vs. holding something in your pocket and claiming to have a gun.

North Korea is an irritant. Really, they exist purely at our pleasure. Any President in the last 55 years could have 'eliminated' the problem with the touch of a red button.

Kvetching about Clinton or Obama in this course merely serves to mark oneself as a partisan dolt.

The Korean leader knows if he acts up too much, he will get a spanky and not be incharge any more. He has a vested interest in keeping himself in control, alive, screwing foreign models. He won't cross whatever line it is that will make for the Boom Boom on Pyongyang.

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He has a vested interest in keeping himself in control, alive, screwing foreign models. He won't cross whatever line it is that will make for the Boom Boom on Pyongyang.

Except that he's dying, there is a succession struggle, and he has (*( little to lose.

Unfortunately.

Oh, and Lamont, what are you thinking? Was it or was it not a nuke?