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Stephen Mejias
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Fresh Start
In the Announcements thread, you've brought up several concerns about the new forum's look, feel, and functionality.

We've been discussing these concerns with our developers and we'd like to address as many of your concerns as possible. Please understand that the forum's physical format is not going to change, however. That is, we are going to maintain the current width, with ads in the right hand column.

Here's a list of what we know you want:
--The ability to click to posts made in the last 24/48 hours.
--The option to include signatures.
--The ability to show all posts made by a single user.
--Automated subject lines.
--The ability to e-mail posts.
--Links at the header of each forum page allowing easy navigation between the forum categories.
--The ability to post images.
--The ability to italicize text.

Am I forgetting anything?

Further, please let us know what you like/dislike about the forum, and please be specific. How do you use the forum? What do you expect from the forum?

We will do our best to address your concerns and meet your expectations. However, I must ask again that you please be patient while we sort out the bugs that have been found throughout the new site. Redesigning Stereophile.com and integrating all of our content onto a single dedicated server has been a massive project, and we must prioritize our concerns.

Thanks very much.

Catch22
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Heavier font

I'd really like to see a heavier font if possible. I would rank that at the very top of my issues with the current format.

Bob B
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Bring back the menu bar at

Bring back the menu bar at the TOP of the HOME page. Right now we have to scroll to the bottom of the home page to find links to the Forum, Galleries, etc.

That's disappointing you are set with this new format. It has about as much visual impact as a wet newspaper. Lame in this day and age. Sorry.

tomjtx
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Reduce the size of the ads?

Is it possible to reduce the size of the ads? It lokks like they take up 1/3 of the space. How about 25% ?

oops, just re read your post. So no change to width.

In other words, the forum is now only a vehicle for ad revenue. Particularly irritating are the "sponsored technology centers".
Gimme a break :-)

It is a bad call to make the ads so big. Other forums achieve a better balance. Subtlety is sometimes more effective.

John Atkinson
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Re:Bring back the menu bar
Bob B wrote:
Bring back the menu bar at the TOP of the HOME page. Right now we have to scroll to the bottom of the home page to find links to the Forum, Galleries, etc.
I am not sure I understand your criticism. The menu bar is still at the top of the home page.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

Elk
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Edit: as to menu, perhaps he

Edit: as to menu, perhaps he is referring to Home » Forums » General Discussion » Announcements and the like. This easy to access location bar comes and goes, apparently randomly. It should always be present at the top and the bottom of each page.

(My original post content disappeared into the ethers.)

John Atkinson
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Re:Edit: as to menu, perhaps...
Elk wrote:
Edit: as to menu, perhaps he is referring to Home » Forums » General Discussion » Announcements and the like. This easy to access location bar comes and goes, apparently randomly. It should always be present at the top and the bottom of each page.

Again, I don't understand the criticism. On both IE8 and Firefox, these "breadcrumbs" always appear in the same place, at the top of the thread. And the original poster seemed clearly to be referring to the menu bar at the top of each page, which didn't move with the redesign. We did move the subsidiary "landing pages," which used to be along the LH side of the page, to the bottom, in order to generate more space for the wider columns and photos, but his wording suggested that he was not referring to those.

John Atkinson
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RGibran
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Recent posts function 24/48 hours

needs to be implemented ASAP to restore basic function and save this forum while other items are implemented in time, IMHO.

RG

John Atkinson
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Re:Recent posts function 24/48 hours
RGibran wrote:
Recent posts function 24/48 hours needs to be implemented ASAP to restore basic function and save this forum while other items are implemented in time, IMHO.

As Stephen Mejias noted in the post that started this thread, this is on our to-do list.

John Atkinson
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John Atkinson
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Re: Reduce the size of the ads?
tomjtx wrote:
Is it possible to reduce the size of the ads? It looks like they take up 1/3 of the space. How about 25% ?

The ads on the forum are the same size as they are on the rest of the site.

tomjtx wrote:
oops, just re read your post. So no change to width.

As I said in a response to "Elk," the fixed column width for content offers enormous benefits to those who visit the entire site.

tomjtx wrote:
In other words, the forum is now only a vehicle for ad revenue.

Not at all, and I find it personally insulting that you say so. When our site went live on December 1, 1997, I decided that its content would never be hidden behind a pay-to-view barrier, and I have argued the case with successive generations of management that it should remain that way. But something has to pay for the website's costs, and for the readers to continue to have free access to the content, that something has to be advertising.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

JIMV
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Forgotten...the ability to

Dupe...idea

JIMV
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Agreed...the font/color is so

Agreed...the font/color is so faint I have trouble reading it.

JIMV
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Quote:As I said in a response
Quote:

As I said in a response to "Elk," the fixed column width for content offers enormous benefits to those who visit the entire site.

Certainly not the folk who post on it or you wouldn't have as many complaints. It appears you have made it easier in some vague way for casual readers and advertisers while making it harder for steady customers and regular readers or commenters.

Put another way, you seem to believe you have made it easier for guests while not acknowledging it is messier for family.

This forum is still 60-70% black bars and space for advertising with only a tiny minority of space for the reason the forum exists, comment.

Stephen Mejias
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The ratio of forum space to ad/black space
JIMV wrote:
This forum is still 60-70% black bars and space for advertising with only a tiny minority of space for the reason the forum exists, comment.
The ratio of forum space to ad/black space is 50:50 on my screen.
John Atkinson
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Re: Fresh Start
JIMV wrote:
John Atkinson wrote:
As I said in a response to "Elk," the fixed column width for content offers enormous benefits to those who visit the entire site.

Certainly not the folk who post on it or you wouldn't have as many complaints.

The complaints are from forum members, not from visitors to the site as a whole.

JIMV wrote:
It appears you have made it easier in some vague way for casual readers and advertisers while making it harder for steady customers and regular readers or commenters.

The unfortunate reality is that the forum has less than 13,000 users while the rest of the site gets around 350,000 unique visitors each month (audited figure). To refer to the other 338,000 visitors as "casual" readers is not appropriate, I feel. Yes, I appreciate that to each visitor, he is in effect 100% of the audience, but we have to make decisions in light of the needs of everyone who visits our site.

JIMV wrote:
Put another way, you seem to believe you have made it easier for guests while not acknowledging it is messier for family.

That's a fair point. All I can say is that, as Stephen Mejias has already said, we have a list of to-dos to make the forum as much as possible like the old one, other than the 600-pixel column width.

JIMV wrote:
This forum is still 60-70% black bars and space for advertising with only a tiny minority of space for the reason the forum exists, comment.

With respect, you are exaggerating. The forum content width is 600 pixels. I am working on my laptop, which has a 1280 pixel screen width. Thus almost 50% of the screen area is devoted to "the reason the forum exists." What pixel resolution are you working with?

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

Elk
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Explanation
John Atkinson wrote:

Again, I don't understand the criticism. On both IE8 and Firefox, these "breadcrumbs" always appear in the same place, at the top of the thread. [Elk note; for example "Home » Forums » General Discussion » Announcements"

I just double checked. These address markers appear within a thread, but not within a forum.

For example, If I am looking at this thread I see the above address. If I then click on "announcements" I see all the threads in this forum but the address marker is gone.

Thus I need to backtrack or click on the main forums link at the top if I want to look at the next sub-forum.

I hope this makes sense.

JIMV
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For info...My laptop has 11.5

For info...My laptop has 11.5 in horizontal and the actual forum content takes up 4.75 inched leaving most of it without content, just black bars or blank white...

Stephen Mejias
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Breadcrumbs
Elk wrote:
John Atkinson wrote:
Again, I don't understand the criticism. On both IE8 and Firefox, these "breadcrumbs" always appear in the same place, at the top of the thread. [Elk note; for example "Home » Forums » General Discussion » Announcements"
I just double checked. These address markers appear within a thread, but not within a forum. For example, If I am looking at this thread I see the above address. If I then click on "announcements" I see all the threads in this forum but the address marker is gone. Thus I need to backtrack or click on the main forums link at the top if I want to look at the next sub-forum. I hope this makes sense.
Yes, this makes sense, and it's on our list of things to fix.
RGibran
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New posts

seem to take over an hour for thier 'new' text and graphic indicators to show up. Is this going to be typical?

RG

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please clarify
RGibran wrote:

seem to take over an hour for thier 'new' text and graphic indicators to show up. Is this going to be typical?

RG

could you be more specific/explain the issue you're talking about?
what do you mean by "new text" and "graphic indicators"?

Thanks

John Atkinson
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Re: New posts
RGibran wrote:
New posts seem to take over an hour for thier 'new' text and graphic indicators to show up. Is this going to be typical?

Hmmm. I have posted 8 posts to the forum today. In all cases except one, where the server appeared to choke for around 10 seconds, my posts appeared immediately, complete with my avatar image.

We were having occasional traffic management issues with the new server a week ago, but IT fixed that problem.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

Poor Audiophile
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Fresh Start

John, Stephen, Ariel, Jon & whoever else is behind this, my simple minded comment is thanks for all the hard work!!!
BTW, don't you guys have a magazine to put out? lol man, when do you guys sleep? JA mentions "sideways scrolling". I hate that when I go on a site!! All this time I thought it was my computer. Also, I like that I can post a comment at the bottom of the page.
Thanks! Larry

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Grousing was my intention
John Atkinson wrote:
tomjtx wrote:

Is it possible to reduce the size of the ads? It looks like they take up 1/3 of the space. How about 25% ?

The ads on the forum are the same size as they are on the rest of the site.

tomjtx wrote:

oops, just re read your post. So no change to width.

As I said in a response to "Elk," the fixed column width for content offers enormous benefits to those who visit the entire site.

tomjtx wrote:

In other words, the forum is now only a vehicle for ad revenue.

Not at all, and I find it personally insulting that you say so. When our site went live on December 1, 1997, I decided that its content would never be hidden behind a pay-to-view barrier, and I have argued the case with successive generations of management that it should remain that way. But something has to pay for the website's costs, and for the readers to continue to have free access to the content, that something has to be advertising.

John Atkinson

Editor, Stereophile

I didn't intend to be insulting, John. Grousing was my intention :-)

I know the site needs revenue to exist. My apologies.

RGibran
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Clarification
Ariel Bitran wrote:
RGibran wrote:

seem to take over an hour for thier 'new' text and graphic indicators to show up. Is this going to be typical?

RG

could you be more specific/explain the issue you're talking about?
what do you mean by "new text" and "graphic indicators"?

Thanks

I am referring to the star that is suppose to appear on folders for forums with new posts, and the text in the topics column indicating the amount of new.

RG

Stephen Mejias
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New post indicators
RGibran wrote:
Ariel Bitran wrote:
RGibran wrote:
seem to take over an hour for thier 'new' text and graphic indicators to show up. Is this going to be typical? RG
could you be more specific/explain the issue you're talking about? what do you mean by "new text" and "graphic indicators"? Thanks
I am referring to the star that is suppose to appear on folders for forums with new posts, and the text in the topics column indicating the amount of new. RG
Thanks, RG. Ariel and I have been having trouble with that star indicator, too. I never see them in the Announcements folder, and I only sometimes see them in the General Rants'n'Raves folder. I can't identify a pattern to this, but our developer is aware of it and it's on his list.

I haven't had a problem with the "new" text in the topics columns, however. Even when a star hasn't appeared, if I click into a forum, the "new" text indicator will be there for me.

Stephen Mejias
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Font
Catch22 wrote:
I'd really like to see a heavier font if possible. I would rank that at the very top of my issues with the current format.
I am a bit confused by this request because the font is actually slightly darker now than it was on the old forum, and the type has been set with greater space between words and lines.

In addition, we now see the gray type set against a white background, whereas the old forum used gray type against a gray background. There is actually greater contrast now than there was previously.

I'll speak with Jon Iverson regarding the pros/cons of adjusting the type size/color.

Does reading become easier if you zoom in on your screen?

Stephen Mejias
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Rules (as in "lines")
Stephen Mejias wrote:
Catch22 wrote:
I'd really like to see a heavier font if possible. I would rank that at the very top of my issues with the current format.
I am a bit confused by this request because the font is actually slightly darker now than it was on the old forum, and the type has been set with greater space between words and lines.

In addition, we now see the gray type set against a white background, whereas the old forum used gray type against a gray background. There is actually greater contrast now than there was previously.

I'll speak with Jon Iverson regarding the pros/cons of adjusting the type size/color.

Does reading become easier if you zoom in on your screen?

My feeling is that darker rules (I mean bold lines, not a list of regulations) separating posts from one another could also be helpful.
Catch22
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Text
Stephen Mejias wrote:
Stephen Mejias wrote:
Catch22 wrote:

I'd really like to see a heavier font if possible. I would rank that at the very top of my issues with the current format.

I am a bit confused by this request because the font is actually slightly darker now than it was on the old forum, and the type has been set with greater space between words and lines.

In addition, we now see the gray type set against a white background, whereas the old forum used gray type against a gray background. There is actually greater contrast now than there was previously.

I'll speak with Jon Iverson regarding the pros/cons of adjusting the type size/color.

Does reading become easier if you zoom in on your screen?

My feeling is that darker rules (I mean bold lines, not a list of regulations) separating posts from one another could also be helpful.

I agree that darker would be helpful. And, yes, I can zoom in or highlight the text that I wish to read, it's just annoying that the text is difficult to read without doing so. It would seem simple to make the default text a little easier to see, but if I'm the only one finding it difficult then the issue is certainly not worth messing with. Even the response text is easier to see as I type this than the posted text once it finds its way to the thread.

Am I the only one finding this way too difficult to read as it stands now?

Elk
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text

The text is just a tad light. I can read it fine but a bit more contrast would be nice.

You are correct; the "post new comment" text is darker.

Bob B
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Menu Bar
John Atkinson wrote:
Bob B wrote:

Bring back the menu bar at the TOP of the HOME page. Right now we have to scroll to the bottom of the home page to find links to the Forum, Galleries, etc.

I am not sure I understand your criticism. The menu bar is still at the top of the home page.

John Atkinson

Editor, Stereophile

John,
Thank you for your reply. I am talking about the Home page in general - http://www.stereophile.com/ - not the Forum home page. On Stereophile.com, one needs to scroll down through all of the content to find links to other areas of the site, including the forums. Prior to the change, there was a menu bar at the top of the Stereophile.com home page with links to the forums, galleries, etc. That was convenient. Not meant as a criticism; more of a suggestion. Thank you.

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John, Thank you for your

John,
Thank you for your reply. I am talking about the Home page in general - http://www.stereophile.com/ - not the Forum home page. On Stereophile.com, one needs to scroll down through all of the content to find links to other areas of the site, including the forums. Prior to the change, there was a menu bar at the top of the Stereophile.com home page with links to the forums, galleries, etc. That was convenient. Not meant as a criticism; more of a suggestion. Thank you.

John Atkinson
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Re:Bring back the menu bar
Bob B wrote:
John Atkinson wrote:
Bob B wrote:
Bring back the menu bar at the TOP of the HOME page. Right now we have to scroll to the bottom of the home page to find links to the Forum, Galleries, etc.
I am not sure I understand your criticism. The menu bar is still at the top of the home page.

I am talking about the Home page in general - http://www.stereophile.com/ - not the Forum home page. On Stereophile.com, one needs to scroll down through all of the content to find links to other areas of the site, including the forums.

I still don't understand your criticism. The menu bar is still there at the top of every page, immediately beneath the magazine's logo. Is anyone else not seeing the menu bar?

Bob B wrote:
Prior to the change, there was a menu bar at the top of the Stereophile.com home page with links to the forums, galleries, etc. That was convenient.

My apologies, but I am still not getting this. The only change we made to the top of the page in the redesign was to move the banner advertisement below the menu bar. But the menu bar is still there, and will appear "above the fold" when you visit any page on the site.

As I noted a few days ago, we did move the listing of archive categories from the left of the page to the bottom, to make room for the larger photos and text column, but this doesn't appear to be what you referring to.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

Jeff0000
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forum

The "viewed" counter doesn't seem to work.
How do I delete a post?
How do I get to "my" homepage?

While I certainly appreciate all of the hard work and expense in re-tooling the forum ... I was just wondering what was wrong with the old forum, it seems to work just fine.

Jeff

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Answers
Jeff0000 wrote:

The "viewed" counter doesn't seem to work.

Our web developers are working on this.

Jeff0000 wrote:

How do I delete a post?

Do you see a little "delete" box under your post?

Jeff0000 wrote:

How do I get to "my" homepage?

On the right sidebar of the page, below the ads are links to your account maintenance and private message center.

Quote:

While I certainly appreciate all of the hard work and expense in re-tooling the forum ... I was just wondering what was wrong with the old forum, it seems to work just fine.

Previously, our website was divided into four separate Content Management Systems. The new Stereophile website integrates all the previously separated sites (blogs, forums, content, and vote) and brings them into one content management system allowing for increased interrelationship between the different sections of the website highlighting a focus on the content and users interaction will ALL website content.

Jeff0000
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Forum

No, I do not see a little "delete" box under my post. There is "edit", "reply" and "quote".

Jeff

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Forum

Ariel:

Found the "my homepage" link. Thank you.

Jeff

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Delete/Edit
Jeff0000 wrote:

No, I do not see a little "delete" box under my post. There is "edit", "reply" and "quote".

For the time, there is no "delete" button for non-admins. If you wish to remove a post, I suggest selecting "Edit" and indicating removal.

On our last forum, posts could be deleted for a short period of time after original post, but then could not be removed/altered. I've taken note to suggest a "delete" post feature to our web developers.

Thanks for catching this.

dumbo
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...

One thing that I seemed to notice on the new forum is that the "Last Post" status indicator that can be seen while browsing the various sub forum topics doesn't seem to follow the flow of each post within a given thread.

For example, in this thread titled "Fresh Start", before me posting this comment the "Last Post" indicator showed Ariel Bitran but when I clicked into the thread and scrolled to the bottom of the page the last post that was listed was (Post #35) written by Jeff0000. In my experience on other forums, when a new comment is submitted it usually shows up bellow the last post submitted. Here, what I am seeing is that Ariel Bitrans post which was submitted on Dec 14th @ 2:10PM is listed above (Post # 35) submitted on Dec 13th @ 1:46pm and is shown as the last comment in the thread.

Usually this behavior indicates that a post comment was edited after it was submitted. Based on the number of times I am seeing the same behavior in other threads leads me to believe that unless allot of people are going back and editing their last post that something is not right.

Hopefully I was able to put into words what I am seeing. In any event thanks for all your efforts in updating the site.

RGibran
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Bad Default Setting

Per Ariel...Currently if you respond to a post made earlier in a thread (earlier than the latest reply to that post in question), your response will appear threaded below the earlier post but above the later reply.

If you find this confusing and wish to view posts in sequential order (by the date/time they are posted), look at the bottom of the thread for the different "settings" and change to view forum in "Flat List - Expanded" mode. This will order posts as it did on our previous server.

RG

dumbo
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Cool, Thanks for the info

Cool, Thanks for the info

Bob B
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New Post Stars

How come the stars indicating new posts do not always show up on the folder icons? It's getting to be a pain to have to open every forum to see if there are new posts only to find none. Can this be fixed? Thanks.

rvance
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New Layout

I have probably been one of the most obsequious cheerleaders of everything Stereophile on these forums, but... the new layout is constricted and sterile. It impedes the flow of discussion.

The text layout in the old forum was like a living, breathing, soulful thing. A user could follow all the threads easily and jump in without restraint.

The old format was vinyl. This one's MP3.

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Pointless

What's the point of having to post a subject line in a thread that already has a subject?

It is highly annoying.

Ariel Bitran
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I like the subject line

you see, i dont even have to say anything here.

Demondog
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My Post Was Shanghaied.

I posted what I thought was a helpful reply several days ago in the Entry Level/Equipment Racck thread, but got an automatic message that it was withheld for moderation. I've waited to see if it would show up. It hasn't, but I don't feel like recreating it, especially if there was something wrong with it to begin with. Kind of frustrating.

BTW- I'm posting this here because I don't see an obvious link to contact a responsible party.

Ariel Bitran
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Hi Demondog

I'm looking into this.

Thanks for the heads up, and we apologize for the error.

Ariel Bitran
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Should be there now...

got yr back homie.

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